NEW PRODUCT: Taptation Tap Tempo controller

[remmelt]

Some delay designs use a 50K potentiometer for control of the delay
time. The TapTation controller can simulate this potentiometer value
by connecting the Tempo Double Time input to ground. This will
roughly limit the digital potentiometer to the lower half of the
potentiometer thus keeping the maximum value to approximately 50K.

I would like to use the Taptation with an Echo Base. The EB uses a 50K lin pot for delay time.

My questions:

1) Do I still use a 100K lin pot for the time setting? (The one connected to pin 13 of the Taptation)
2) Would this halve the resolution of the digital pot? (If so, does it matter?)
3) Can I still use the Tempo Double Time Input for its intended purpose?

[remmelt]

More questions:

"It's that simple. Instead of wiring the time pot to the echo base board, you wire it per the schematic to the taptation circuit. Then just wire +5v, ground, and pin 6 of the PT2399 to the taptation circuit as indicated in the taptation schematic and you are in business." (source)

Echo Base v2 schematic

4) In the EB schematic, the Time pot (connected to the PT's pin 6) has a connection to the collector of the BC560 on the other side. What do I do with that connection? Can I just leave it open? I'm planning on using the EB's modulation for now.
5) The original 50K time pot: do I just take this out of the circuit?
6) If I want to use a 50K pot instead of the supplied 100K one, can I just substitute the MCP41100 for a MCP41050? Is this even necessary?

I'm busy getting this to work on my breadboard, then I can probably answer some of these questions by just poking around. I want to minimize the number of possible failing points though, is why I'm asking in here!

[slacker]

The EB will work fine with a 100k pot, the longer delay times will be a bit noisy, but no more than any other PT2399 based pedal, so you can use the taptation in 100k mode.
To use it with the EB's modulation you just connect the digital pot in place of the time pot, between pin 6 of the PT2399 and the transistor. You may want to a 1k resistor in series, as per the taptation datasheet.

[Moonibopper]

Any other suggestions? Tried this and still here ticking.

should only effect led brightness. they will get dimmer as you increase the value.

*also* a large cap, at least 100uf, across the power supply input if not already present, assuming that both circuits already have their own. if not, add them.

Just as a reference for other builds:
I got ticking from the leds (I had to turn up my amp quite a bit) when I switched the power supply of my PT80 with taptation from an isolated multi outlet power supply to a 1-spot with daisy chains.
A 100uf across the power supply of the taptation and a 100R resistor in series with the power supply solved the ticking. I can now use it with no problems with both power supplies.

[Marcvv]

Any other suggestions? Tried this and still here ticking

How do you power the taptation ? Do you have it run on its own 5 volt regulator and have its own ground? Then with the filtering as I posted it is working fine for me.

[Moonibopper]

yes it does have it's own 5V regulator... the regulator is receiving it's 9v from the shared 9v source... what do you mean by it's own ground? the ground of the taptation and the echo circuit are tied together.

Any other suggestions? Tried this and still here ticking

How do you power the taptation ? Do you have it run on its own 5 volt regulator and have its own ground? Then with the filtering as I posted it is working fine for me.

[Marcvv]

Keep the ground separate up to only one point in your build. e.g. the ground on the input jack or the dc input. But you might have that already.
Did you keep the connection from the taptation to pin 6 short? It says in the datasheet that that is a part that could pick up noise.
Maybe try another orientation of the pcb's in your build.

Best,
Marc

[Beo]

If you are making your own PCB, it helps to identify digital signals versus analog (i.e. audio carrying paths). Keeping the digital grounds connected to each other, and the analog ground to each other, and only letting the two meet at one connection is best. Connect your ground wire near this connection and send to your ground point (input jack) lets all digital and audio ground drain to the enclosure without affecting each other. I usually use ground pour polygons to cover my audio devices and paths, and connect digital grounds only using line traces.

If you are using perf or vero, not sure what I can suggestion. If there's a way to do the layout to keep digital ground separate from audio ground until one point, that is best. I noticed on the breadboard with a dual delay setup that separate 5v regulation for digital chips (taptation) vs audio carrying chips (opamp, pt2399, 4066) was important.

[quad]

Hey guys,

I did a layout today, but it's for a modified version. I don't want a Double Time switch, nor do I want a switch for the time divisions. I also didn't need the modulation, and so I left that out entirely. Since the tap time is quarter notes the way I set it up, I just used one LED for the indicator, instead of one for the tempo and one for the divisions. I also put an onboard 5v regulator and 9V input, that way it can be used very easily.



So, it's just a quarter note tap tempo controller with an indicator LED this way. Whatcha think? I'll be getting someone to etch me a copy of this in the near future, and I'll verify it before I post any other documentation.

Jacob

Will this layout work? Momentary switch to tap in the delay time is all I need. Besides that, I have no room for a momentary switch on my enclosure, which is already packed in tight. I was thinking of putting the momentary switch nearby in a different (very small) enclosure by using a 2.1 jack, for instance. Two wires is all I need. Is that correct?

One more question: the time pot. Do I have to disconnect the time pot from the delay itself and connect it to the taptation PCB time terminals?

[jkokura]

Long story short - I'm developing a PCB you can buy to run the Taptation. Actually, I'll have three available - a mini version, a basic version, a modulating version.

Stay tuned to JMK PCBs for more details in the future: http://www.jmkpedals.com/JMK_Pedals/JMK_PCBs.html

Jacob

[jimosity]

Looks like the taptation kit is not available in the store.
Is there somewhere else I can purchase or will it be back in stock soon?

[Moonibopper]

If you are making your own PCB, it helps to identify digital signals versus analog (i.e. audio carrying paths). Keeping the digital grounds connected to each other, and the analog ground to each other, and only letting the two meet at one connection is best. Connect your ground wire near this connection and send to your ground point (input jack) lets all digital and audio ground drain to the enclosure without affecting each other. I usually use ground pour polygons to cover my audio devices and paths, and connect digital grounds only using line traces.

If you are using perf or vero, not sure what I can suggestion. If there's a way to do the layout to keep digital ground separate from audio ground until one point, that is best. I noticed on the breadboard with a dual delay setup that separate 5v regulation for digital chips (taptation) vs audio carrying chips (opamp, pt2399, 4066) was important.

So when the rebote 2.5 with taptation on perf is hooked up with a true bypass pedal before it the ticking is minimal. When its a buffered bypass pedal before it, its gone. When the input jack of the delay is unplugged the ticking is really loud. Does this help sort out the ticking at all?

[jimosity]

Is the PCB above verified?
What are the part values or did I miss them posted somewhere else?

[jkokura]

Jim, I'll be releasing some PCBs you can purchase shortly. I'm waiting for more taptation chips to arrive so I can verify the layouts. If you'd like more info, you can PM me.

Jacob

[Cannibal]

sorrry if this seems a silly question but i am new to this kind of stuff. If i don't want to have led indicators for tempo subdivisions should I ground the resistor or leave the pin unconnected? Also i wanna thank you all since i learned almonst everything from this forum.

[The Tone God]

sorrry if this seems a silly question but i am new to this kind of stuff. If i don't want to have led indicators for tempo subdivisions should I ground the resistor or leave the pin unconnected? Also i wanna thank you all since i learned almonst everything from this forum.

This is not a silly question, it would only be silly to not ask.

If you don't want an LED just leave the pin unconnected. You don't need the resistor from the pin either.

Andrew

[jkokura]

If you haven't become aware yet, JMK PCBs has released Taptation PCBs (with permission of TTG), and are now for sale. Check them out at the website if you're interested.

Jacob

[hammy9]

I recently just build the Echo Base and am using the Taptation to control it (using the taptation pcb from guitarpcb).  The tap tempo and time divisions work great    I am having trouble getting the modulation of the EB (not Taptations modulation) to work properly.  i tested it without the taptation connected and using the regular time pot and mod works fine.  I also tried feeding the BC560 of EB with pin 7 of the digital pot (I've left the mod part of the Taptation unconnected).  I get some modulation but the tempo is almost half of what the tempo LED says it should be.  Any ideas?

Thanks!
Ryan

[Valoosj]

The EB will work fine with a 100k pot, the longer delay times will be a bit noisy, but no more than any other PT2399 based pedal, so you can use the taptation in 100k mode.
To use it with the EB's modulation you just connect the digital pot in place of the time pot, between pin 6 of the PT2399 and the transistor. You may want to a 1k resistor in series, as per the taptation datasheet.

So pin 5 and 6 of the MCP go to pin 6 of the PT2399. And where do you add the collector of the BC560 and the 39K and 1K then?

I'm making my own layout so I need to keep analog and digital ground separate. Digital ground is everything involving the taptation and the PT2399 IC?

[scalefreak]

After perusing the interwebs for weeks looking for a pcb of either the pt-80 with the taptation and all features included or just a taptation pcb with all features, it looks like there are none available. I have built a pt-80 with the taptation and want to build another, but the box I want to cram it in.......I just need more room. Has anyone done a pcb that works yet. I'll etch my own if I have to, just wondering if anyone has a layout or a resource for acquiring one.

Hey! After years of lurking and making use of the wealth of info here, I finally registered and posted! Woot!

Thanks guys!

Chris