Forum FV-1 project

[Ice-9]

I was thinkng about doing a project based around the Spin semi FV-1 chip for the forum adding in everything (or the best of) what people would like. If any one is interested please put forward any ideas.

Some of the questions i would ask to start with are for instance , what size enclosure would everyone prefer? Would anyone prefer SMD as opposed to through hole components ? Stereo ins/outs or mono ? Would it be preferable to have a daughter board that can be used to incorperaate into other circuits ?

I hope there is some interest in this great chip.

I have made some pedals  before with this chip, here is a pic of one past project i have done.

[Govmnt_Lacky]

For the most part, I believe the forumites prefer through-hole components as they are easier to work with. 

[bean]

I would be very interested if the SMD part was kept to a minimum. Solder one IC is preferable to almost all SMD, IMO. I'm very curious to find out more about what you've done so far!

[Skruffyhound]

This is a great idea Mick, I'm definitely up for it.
SMD would require me to stock up, but actually I'm also up for that, although I guess the majority vote will be for through hole. The daughter board sounds like a good idea.
I'll go and do some more reading.
Thanks for doing this, I wouldn't have got around to this for a little while, but a forum project makes it more accessible.

[Ice-9]

I would be very interested if the SMD part was kept to a minimum. Solder one IC is preferable to almost all SMD, IMO. I'm very curious to find out more about what you've done so far!

I understand what has been said about using as many through hole components as possible, and of course that makes it more accessable to the larger amount of builders.

So far I have built a few different units which the main one has been documented here in a thread some time ago, some sound clips were posted.
As for future development my excitement lies in the addition of adding a smart card slot whereby different effect patches can be loaded into the unit. This is something i have looked into and have had some success with but as yet have not had enough time to fully develop. I am beginning this thread now as i do have some time to give to develop some ideas to this project now.

I think it's such a good chip that it would benefit from forum development, and if we get something lots of us are happy with  i would be happy to get the PCBs made that we can use.

[jkokura]

I'm very much in.

I've been looking at the FV-1 because it makes a great foundation for a GOOD reverb pedal. The WET for example, it's all the rage at TGP. It's really useful because it can be reprogrammed, though the effects already in there sound good to my ears (admittedly second hand, through youtube and friend's opinions).

The Belton brick is big, but it's a good option if you want something in a 1590BB. The only real way to get the FV-1 to fill the gap the Belton based BYOC and the GGG projects have, is to have the FV-1 project fit into a 125B or 1590B size enclosure.

As for the SMD arguement - the less there's SMD, the better in my opinion. The vast majority of us have stock of the through hole stuff coming out our ears. Locating the SMD parts will bring the interest in this project down I'd imagine.

Oh yeah - stereo ins and out would be the bomb.

Jacob

[Ice-9]

This is a great idea Mick, I'm definitely up for it.
SMD would require me to stock up, but actually I'm also up for that, although I guess the majority vote will be for through hole. The daughter board sounds like a good idea.
I'll go and do some more reading.
Thanks for doing this, I wouldn't have got around to this for a little while, but a forum project makes it more accessible.

One of the things I've noticed with SMD is that stocking up on the components is really cheap in the most part, for example i can buy 100 resistors for 0.63p UK. Some of the effects i have made PCBs for I have done in SMD just to save me drilling the pcb holes, and to stop me getting those little component cut off leads that fly off in all directions puncturing my feet.

One thing we could look at though is keeping all components like resistors, capacitors etc through hole while maybe using SMD Ic's

I am really looking for everyones input here so we can develop this the way all the forum members want.

[Ice-9]

I'm very much in.

I've been looking at the FV-1 because it makes a great foundation for a GOOD reverb pedal. The WET for example, it's all the rage at TGP. It's really useful because it can be reprogrammed, though the effects already in there sound good to my ears (admittedly second hand, through youtube and friend's opinions).

The Belton brick is big, but it's a good option if you want something in a 1590BB. The only real way to get the FV-1 to fill the gap the Belton based BYOC and the GGG projects have, is to have the FV-1 project fit into a 125B or 1590B size enclosure.

As for the SMD arguement - the less there's SMD, the better in my opinion. The vast majority of us have stock of the through hole stuff coming out our ears. Locating the SMD parts will bring the interest in this project down I'd imagine.

Oh yeah - stereo ins and out would be the bomb.

Jacob

The general opinion up to now seems to be not to use SMD. One of the problems with fitting into a 1590b will be how many component can we squeeze in there. Stereo in/outs could be crammed in as long as the battery is junked and we use PSU only. whats your opinions on that.
One of my aims was to fit it into a 1590b as well.

[jkokura]

I'm very much in.

I've been looking at the FV-1 because it makes a great foundation for a GOOD reverb pedal. The WET for example, it's all the rage at TGP. It's really useful because it can be reprogrammed, though the effects already in there sound good to my ears (admittedly second hand, through youtube and friend's opinions).

The Belton brick is big, but it's a good option if you want something in a 1590BB. The only real way to get the FV-1 to fill the gap the Belton based BYOC and the GGG projects have, is to have the FV-1 project fit into a 125B or 1590B size enclosure.

As for the SMD arguement - the less there's SMD, the better in my opinion. The vast majority of us have stock of the through hole stuff coming out our ears. Locating the SMD parts will bring the interest in this project down I'd imagine.

Oh yeah - stereo ins and out would be the bomb.

Jacob

The general opinion up to now seems to be not to use SMD. One of the problems with fitting into a 1590b will be how many component can we squeeze in there. Stereo in/outs could be crammed in as long as the battery is junked and we use PSU only. whats your opinions on that.
One of my aims was to fit it into a 1590b as well.

I wonder if we could do it more like a 1590B/125B if you want mono, and bigger if you want stereo (1590BB or larger)? Yes, the SMD thing will likely be preffered to be avoided I would bet, but you do raise a good point on how much cheaper it is.

Jacob

[Ice-9]

I wonder if we could do it more like a 1590B/125B if you want mono, and bigger if you want stereo (1590BB or larger)? Yes, the SMD thing will likely be preffered to be avoided I would bet, but you do raise a good point on how much cheaper it is.

Jacob

Yes, the different size enclosures could work well, I am quite sure it's also possible to fit stereo ins/outs into a 1590b as well . One question, though is stereo in needed, as mono in / stereo out could be used to save space in smaller enclosures, also stereo in/out could be added using single TRS jacks but that is a bit of a cheat really.

We need to ask, if this is to fit into a 1590b what are the goalposts on the design , do we want the data pot for selecting the 8 internal and 8 external programs or shall the design be a singal reverb type of other effect.

[bean]

Assuming the project does develop, a double sided PCB would offer the option of putting the ICs on one side of the board to open a little more real estate. 4 layer could also help, and Laen does offer a 4-layer proto service over at dorkbotpdx. But, I also know jack about digital electronics so this might be a terrible idea on my part.

But, really, I'd be less concerned about a 125B over 1590BB if it meant having to give up the flexibility and added bells and whistles. It's not like we are talking EH type enclosures here! Stereo outs and a smart card = one bad mofo.

[Ice-9]

I have to agree on the double sided idea, any SMD ic's on one side means other components on the other side can go right across IC's on the other side meaning lots of room for stuff.
I have done the maths on the card slot and that is not possible with a 1590b, it just doesnt fit.
this could be quite an exciting project so lets keep the ideas coming in, and we can all develop it from there.
i will post a couple of old sound clips from the fv-1 that were recorded from the circuit in the picture in the first post (for reference).

[tiges_ tendres]

I would love to see a project for this.  I have been corresponding with Piet from the excellent Echo Tapper page and am about to get one of this boards made so I can make use of the Oct distribution plug in board.  Have you looked into that option at all?  From reading some of the spin forums it does appear that these can also be programmed fairly easily

Here is what I would like to see:

- Through hole components. (Sorry, I'm not ready to take the plunge on learning a new technique with a project so much more complicated than I am used to)

- Enclosure size.  Not too worried about size myself.  I think if a pedal is worthy of being on a board, you can squeeze it in regardless of how many other pedals you have.

- Daughter board.  Great Idea!  See the Oct distribution available boards if you haven't already.

- Stereo Ins/Outs.  This should be trivial in regards to the design to make this an option for the builders preference.  From going over the notes on the Oct Dist. boards a few times, it seems that a couple of jumpers is all it would take to be the difference between stereo and mono.

- Controls. As above, I think the circuit design for the board could include options for the builder to decide if they want the data pot or simply set and forget.  I think the external circuitry needed to access the 8 extra programmable presets might be too complicated to be something included as a builder option.  Correct me if I'm wrong on that though, but I thought it involved some kind of logic switching with a 16 pin chip.

I would stress that you will get a lot more interest for this project if you make it as flexible as you can.  Also, I would love to try a simpler SMD project, perhaps once this reverb is done we could all look into something like a booster or a fuzz in SMD to get our feet wet?

[puretube]

4-layer-vero... 

[tiges_ tendres]

Shoot, just checked my notes on the stereo in and out.  Looks like each would need their own separate preamps.  Although board size would increase, it would still be possible to design it for stereo and simply leave out those components from your build if you wanted mono.  THEN, you could jumper those unused pins.

Silly me!

[Ice-9]

I would love to see a project for this.  I have been corresponding with Piet from the excellent Echo Tapper page and am about to get one of this boards made so I can make use of the Oct distribution plug in board. Have you looked into that option at all? From reading some of the spin forums it does appear that these can also be programmed fairly easily

Here is what I would like to see:

- Through hole components. (Sorry, I'm not ready to take the plunge on learning a new technique with a project so much more complicated than I am used to)

- Enclosure size. Not too worried about size myself.  I think if a pedal is worthy of being on a board, you can squeeze it in regardless of how many other pedals you have.

- Daughter board.  Great Idea!  See the Oct distribution available boards if you haven't already.

- Stereo Ins/Outs.  This should be trivial in regards to the design to make this an option for the builders preference.  From going over the notes on the Oct Dist. boards a few times, it seems that a couple of jumpers is all it would take to be the difference between stereo and mono.

- Controls. As above, I think the circuit design for the board could include options for the builder to decide if they want the data pot or simply set and forget.  I think the external circuitry needed to access the 8 extra programmable presets might be too complicated to be something included as a builder option.  Correct me if I'm wrong on that though, but I thought it involved some kind of logic switching with a 16 pin chip.

I would stress that you will get a lot more interest for this project if you make it as flexible as you can.  Also, I would love to try a simpler SMD project, perhaps once this reverb is done we could all look into something like a booster or a fuzz in SMD to get our feet wet?

I have also talked to Piet for a while through emails ,  he contacted me with some questions. and his project is fantastic ,also Frank the designer of the FV-1 posted on my original project with lots of help to get it off the ground. So Thanks Frank and Piet.
For the 16pin logic chip for selection, that is not needed as i have sourced some data pots that have 4 pins that do the same job.

One of my first projects SMD was a simple distortion/overdrive which i posted on diystomboxes. i will find the lthreadand post for you

[jkokura]

I wonder if we could do it more like a 1590B/125B if you want mono, and bigger if you want stereo (1590BB or larger)? Yes, the SMD thing will likely be preffered to be avoided I would bet, but you do raise a good point on how much cheaper it is.

Jacob

Yes, the different size enclosures could work well, I am quite sure it's also possible to fit stereo ins/outs into a 1590b as well . One question, though is stereo in needed, as mono in / stereo out could be used to save space in smaller enclosures, also stereo in/out could be added using single TRS jacks but that is a bit of a cheat really.

We need to ask, if this is to fit into a 1590b what are the goalposts on the design , do we want the data pot for selecting the 8 internal and 8 external programs or shall the design be a singal reverb type of other effect.

Wow, the possibilities are just endless aren't they!

I guess the real question is the last. Is this to be a quality, small scale (as in 1590B or 125B or whatever) Reverb, or the muliteffects powerhouse of a DIY project? Ultimately, I'd like both, but I would suspect that they're really separate projects.

Personally, I can see the value of a stereo in and stereo in Reverb. Lots of delays are now Stereo output, and in order to use those in Stereo with one of these delays (Like the DD7, El Capistan, Timefactor, Echo Park) and have the Reverb after you'd need stereo. But I also want a really simple 125B mono Reverb. The Belton Brick is a little bit too big for that I think. I want something about the size of a WET that I can partner with my Aquaboy or Rebote 2.5 at the end of my chain. I want both, but I imagine getting both from the one 'forum project' is selfish on my part. I think really what needs to happen is to have everyone really state what the end result they would like to see happen would be, and then go with the general consensus.

I can also imagine a super 1590BB size stereo in stereo out multi-effects unit out of this thing... could be pretty crazy. I'd build any of them, and I want all of them I think.

Jacob

[Ice-9]

4-layer-vero... 

for 4 layer ver you need to talk to this guy  Christopher Tarnovsky with his FIB Lol, (electron microscopes havent got a look in) OT

[Ice-9]

I wonder if we could do it more like a 1590B/125B if you want mono, and bigger if you want stereo (1590BB or larger)? Yes, the SMD thing will likely be preffered to be avoided I would bet, but you do raise a good point on how much cheaper it is.

Jacob

Yes, the different size enclosures could work well, I am quite sure it's also possible to fit stereo ins/outs into a 1590b as well . One question, though is stereo in needed, as mono in / stereo out could be used to save space in smaller enclosures, also stereo in/out could be added using single TRS jacks but that is a bit of a cheat really.

We need to ask, if this is to fit into a 1590b what are the goalposts on the design , do we want the data pot for selecting the 8 internal and 8 external programs or shall the design be a singal reverb type of other effect.

Wow, the possibilities are just endless aren't they!

I guess the real question is the last. Is this to be a quality, small scale (as in 1590B or 125B or whatever) Reverb, or the muliteffects powerhouse of a DIY project? Ultimately, I'd like both, but I would suspect that they're really separate projects.

Personally, I can see the value of a stereo in and stereo in Reverb. Lots of delays are now Stereo output, and in order to use those in Stereo with one of these delays (Like the DD7, El Capistan, Timefactor, Echo Park) and have the Reverb after you'd need stereo. But I also want a really simple 125B mono Reverb. The Belton Brick is a little bit too big for that I think. I want something about the size of a WET that I can partner with my Aquaboy or Rebote 2.5 at the end of my chain. I want both, but I imagine getting both from the one 'forum project' is selfish on my part. I think really what needs to happen is to have everyone really state what the end result they would like to see happen would be, and then go with the general consensus.

I can also imagine a super 1590BB size stereo in stereo out multi-effects unit out of this thing... could be pretty crazy. I'd build any of them, and I want all of them I think.

Jacob

I agree totally, thats why maybe using a main board that would fit a 1590b lets say , but also has a header to expand it to a larger  enclosure giving moe posibilities.  There is more options already from a single pcb . It could be a size related modular system to expand with different sized enclosures giving more options all along the way.

[Ice-9]

here is an old sound clip from the circuit in the picture at the thread start.
the guitar was recorded direct into FV-1 then direct into Pc - nothing else . Starts with clean sound then each bit adds chorus then reverb and then just maxing out levels.


www.rsmcomputers.co.uk/sounds/fv-1.wav

this one is direct into a BSIAB2 thats modded a bit, then into the FV-1 for the reverb. After that its straight into the PC sound card. Just to show how the reverb sounds with distortion.


www.rsmcomputers.co.uk/sounds/messing.wav