Tremulus Lune too Slow!

[Kearns892]

Hey all. I just finished a tremulus lune using tonepad's layout built to specs http://tonepad.com/getFile.asp?id=84, only I added the Ramp Up/ Ramp Down mod http://fuzzcentral.ssguitar.com/tremulus.php, subbed a 100k for the 25k trim pot (didn't have a 25k on hand and was recommended on Tonepad as a sub) and, per the suggestion made by many others who have built the Lune in the past, I omitted the "fine" control.

My only issue is the Tremolo is far too slow, and does not reach a usable tempo until the last 10% of the pot's rotation which leaves little flexibility. I've done some searching and found another thread where somewhere had a similar problem, but it was left unresolved. Is this just the nature of the pedal? If so my first thought would be to swap the linear pot for a reverse log; has anyone done this or something similar? Or, is this not normal behavior and I simply have made an error? I can post voltages if that's the case. For now I will double check the values of the resistors that affect the speed of the LED.

Thanks

[El Heisenberg]

?

I have the opposite problem, although I'm sure my Tremulus Lune builds are both working perfectly. Same mods you did except I included the 'fine' control.  I think the tremulus lune doesn't go slow enough! You can max the spacing to get slower speeds and even turn down the smoothness and have the fine and speed controls down with depth maxed and it's too fast for me!!! I just want a slow trem I guess.

Sorry this doesn't help much. And about the "fine" control. I like it. Since the speed is pretty fast for my taste, I like to fine tune it with the...'fine' control to perfectly match the drum machine or loop or if it's at a certain depth setting or something.


I dunno, is yours really THAT slow??? Maybe a sound clip?

actually it could be just a crappy speed pot. Is it recylced or brand new? If it's recylced or mangled they can act weird.

The controls are interactive too so the spacing control will change the way the others act.

[twabelljr]

I've done some searching and found another thread where somewhere had a similar problem, but it was left unresolved.

How about this one: http://commonsound.org/fud/index.php?t=msg&th=377&start=0&S=39dfa533072373118812f0bbdc819b4c??
Or this: http://commonsound.org/fud/index.php?t=msg&th=341&start=0&S=39dfa533072373118812f0bbdc819b4c?

[El Heisenberg]

...time to add a toggle so i can slow speeds!!


"several seconds between pulses"...!!!!!!!



That would OFFICIALLY make this the best tremolo ever!!

[Le québécois]

My only issue is the Tremolo is far too slow, and does not reach a usable tempo until the last 10% of the pot's rotation which leaves little flexibility. I've done some searching and found another thread where somewhere had a similar problem, but it was left unresolved.

I did the same thing (no fine control + 100 k pot instead of the 1 k 10 k combo of tonepad).  On my breadboard, I found that 1 uf 4.7 uf and 10 uf give a good gradient of speed from totally fast to to long enough at least for me. The 100 uf is way to big and take all a guitar lick to recharge! 47 uF was the biggest value I accept.

good luck
Charles

[El Heisenberg]

I just built it as is on fuzzcentral. I used a 10uf time cap, 10k speed, 1k fine and 2k2 speed resistor. Works fine, but wish I could go slower. I wish I could get a pulse, or a swell effect that comes with slower trems. Instead of just plain 'tremlolo"

[Kearns892]

I can try and get a sound clip up in a day or so, but if you are only looking for speeds, I can use the Rate LED to give you a rough estimate which should serve the purpose.

At 12 o'clock the cycle is about 2 seconds from peak to peak or about 30 bpm, and 9 o'clock is almost 4 seconds for a cycle! Things don't start to get into a decent bpm range until about 3 o'clock on the rotation.  Having the slow speeds could be nice for some things for sure, but my primary use of the tremolo would be in tempo with a song.

I did the same thing (no fine control + 100 k pot instead of the 1 k 10 k combo of tonepad).  On my breadboard, I found that 1 uf 4.7 uf and 10 uf give a good gradient of speed from totally fast to to long enough at least for me. The 100 uf is way to big and take all a guitar lick to recharge! 47 uF was the biggest value I accept.

good luck
Charles

Are you referring to the cap that is 100 uF on the tonepad schematic connected to the speed and smooth pots?

?

I have the opposite problem, although I'm sure my Tremulus Lune builds are both working perfectly. Same mods you did except I included the 'fine' control.  I think the tremulus lune doesn't go slow enough! You can max the spacing to get slower speeds and even turn down the smoothness and have the fine and speed controls down with depth maxed and it's too fast for me!!! I just want a slow trem I guess.

Sorry this doesn't help much. And about the "fine" control. I like it. Since the speed is pretty fast for my taste, I like to fine tune it with the...'fine' control to perfectly match the drum machine or loop or if it's at a certain depth setting or something.


I dunno, is yours really THAT slow??? Maybe a sound clip?

actually it could be just a crappy speed pot. Is it recylced or brand new? If it's recylced or mangled they can act weird.

The controls are interactive too so the spacing control will change the way the others act.

The speed pot is a brand new alpha from small bear (not even the cheap futurlec alpha i generally use). I didn't test the pot specifically with a meter, but I suppose I could have gotten a bad pot.


Thanks for the feedback. I'm starting a new semester, and I will try to check into these things and give you all an update, but it may be a few days.

[Le québécois]

Are you referring to the cap that is 100 uF on the tonepad schematic connected to the speed and smooth pots?

Yes. The one they say that should be replace by a 10 uF in the tonepad report.

[Kearns892]

Ah... I see now. I will have to make the adjustment next chance I get. What effects should the other value changes give?

[Le québécois]

In fact, I can't explain you how, but what I think (and I may be wrong) is that this capacitor need to recharge every time you hit a note. the charging discharging time is what really matter to have on / off / on / off tremolo effect. If you exactly follow the tonepad schematic (10k pots ) + 100 uF cap you have a bigger cap to charge but it is compensate by the lower resistance in the speed path (10 k + 100 ohm + 1 k). If you do the mods, then you have a 10 uf cap (so ten time faster to recharge)  ..... well probably not that simple but I let this for more experimented person to explain) so 10 time faster to recharge but you feed it with 10 time less current because of the higher resistance in the speed path (100 k + 10 k + 2.7k or something close). In theory any of these options give the same speed and this is why both version work.

Ah... I see now. I will have to make the adjustment next chance I get. What effects should the other value changes give?

The other value changes ... If you refer to the other cap value that I suggested before then the only important thing is : the higher is the cap value the longer it take to recharge (assuming the resistance in the speed path is constant -- 100 k pot + fine pot + 2.7k). After playing with it I have found that 1uf was good for my fast tremolo taste while you can add in parallel (done with a switch) another 4.7 uf or even 10 uf to reduced the speed. The lower speed with the 1uf cap is close to the fastest speed that you achieve with the 10 uf. I still have to play with that since I want to minimize speed overlap between both low vs fast mod. This mod is explain on the commonsound website (doubling speed mod or something like that).

I hope It's not to erroneous! But that what I've concluded with my breadboard

[chemosis]

yes i have the same exact problem. the things to slow and what cap is the time constant??

[nocentelli]

10u cap us the time constant: I built a version of the tremulus lune using a 4u7 timing cap, a single C100k speed pot and a 1k5 to set the maximum rate.

[snk]

10u cap us the time constant: I built a version of the tremulus lune using a 4u7 timing cap, a single C100k speed pot and a 1k5 to set the maximum rate.

Hello, I am planning to build a Tremulus Lune, and i wish it could be quite slow.
I understand that changing the 10µF cap value will change the timing, but am I right assuming that increasing the cap size will allow for slower times, or will it work the other way (decrease the cap value to reach slower times) ?

[nocentelli]

Bigger cap = slower maximum and minimum speed. Double the cap to a 22u and it will go twice as slow, 33u three times slower. You can compensate for slowing the maximum speed by reducing the minimum speed setting resistor, but don't do below 1k-ish or it will crap out at maximum speed. An alternative would be to use a switch to add a bigger cap in parallel with a smaller cap, e.g. a 2u2 for fast and a 22u added in parallel for super-slow.

[snk]

Perfect
Thank you, Nocentelli.

[snk]

Argh, i thought i had a bunch of 4558 opamps, and i don't have them anymore (and i don't have any TL062 either)
Could i try with a 5532 or a TL072 instead (i know that in some situations the 4558 can be replaced by a 5532, but in this circuit i don't know) ?

[nocentelli]

I don't think the actual dual opamp used for either section (LFO or audio) is critical for getting it working. In the past, I have preferentially used a TL062 for the LFO, but only because i read something (probably here at DIYSB) about it having a lower current draw and so may be less prone to ticking. I'm sure i've breadboarded it in the past with TL072 and it worked fine.