Line6 Tonecore module repair

[au_loki]

Just wondering if anyone has successfully resurrected one of these little beasts (enough of them die without warning)
My EchoPark module has died and I might just have the schematics (shhhhh!!)
All that happens is a red light on and no signal through the pedal and no amount of foot switching does anything.

Looking forward to your success stories.
Later au_loki

[roseblood11]

Same problem here.
My Echo Park makes strange howling noises, no delay signal at the output. The LED is flickering green. I combined various tonecore docks with various modules, so I'm sure that the problem is in the module, not the dock.  I'd like to repair it, but I have no idea, where to start...

[roseblood11]

Update: my Echo Park isn't dead completely, it makes some weird noises, sometimes even delay repeats.
If I use tap tempo, the led shows the corrects speed. But if I touch the time or modulation pots, or the 11-way selector (which is a pot as well), the led starts flickering very quickly, almost invisible.
I know that the module only contains a MCU that reads the pots, which  are all wired as voltage.dividers between +3.3v and gnd, the wipers go to the control inputs of the mcu.

Is it possible that all the strange behavior could be caused by a dirty or defective pot? These 9mm Alphas collect a lot of dirt and you can't clean them...

[roseblood11]

the schematic from the tonecore developer kit might be helpful, the module is on the last page:
https://www.google.de/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=http://l6c-acdn2.line6.net/data/6/0a06434c149ca520beb4c09cdc/application/pdf/TCDDK%2520Hardware%2520Guide%2520(%2520Rev%2520A%2520).pdf&ved=0ahUKEwjKlL2rtP7UAhWBK1AKHT9wDFkQFggnMAA&usg=AFQjCNEWyt7cfqyDUyyOAMddCg-P-viULw

[Digital Larry]

It does kinda sound like pots are worn out.  I have two Tonecore developer modules which I never used and are loaded with the default, very exciting, used by your favorite really famous guitar player (cough) 2- band EQ (cough).  Probably doesn't do you much good though.  I'd vote for trying to replace the pots, if you can do that without destroying it.

[ElectricDruid]

Could it be bad connections? The Dock part has to read *all* the DSP code off the Module at start-up. If that process screws up, you'll get total nonsense, if you get anything at all. So a decent comms link (SPI, in this case) between the two is going to be vital.

HTH,
Tom

[roseblood11]

That was my first thought. But I treated all the contacts with de-oxyde and sand paper, nothing changed.
But it's true that the problem starts at power up, before I touch any pot.

I measured all the pots today, the seem to be ok. And because there is some kind of delay effect and modulation, I think that the DSP is working. And as there are changes when I move a pot, I think that the MCU is working as well.
I don't know what to try next.
I read many reports about broken tonecore pedals and it seems that the Echo Park has more problems than the others. Why could that be? It has an additional memory chip and maybe the pots get used more often than in a reverb pedal...?

[aron]

Are you guys running with dedicated power supply like a one spot?

[roseblood11]

No, but it should be a power supply with isolated outputs.

[roseblood11]

any news?

I gave up at some point and bought another delay pedal, but it would be great to bring the Echo Park back to life.

[audioartillery]

I only have the developer kit modules but I've found them and the docks to be flaky over time. I've had issues with the footswitch as well as the pots. I've pretty much given up on that platform even though it was an awesome concept.

[ElectricDruid]

Yeah, it was a nice concept. I was thinking they could have even done Tonecore pedalboards with 5 or 6 blank docks in. Just plug in your favourite modules. The board could handle routing, and (if their software allowed it) programmability. Another pipe dream.

It's worth noting that it seems to have been the mechanical part that let it down. I haven't heard loads of complaining about the sounds or the electronics, but the mechanical reliability of something that you can plug in and out is a big hurdle to clear.

[audioartillery]

I think the architecture had a major cost disadvantage. There wasn't any practical reason for the modular design — judging from the amount of standalone tonecore modules floating around for sale (not many) I'm guessing customers only ever bought full units. Production cost was probably double what it would have been for a normally integrated unit.

[ElectricDruid]

There's definitely some cost penalty to be paid, for sure. But the build cost is the smaller part of the price of a pedal anyway, so that might not be a critical issue.

Probably the idea only appealed to DSP developers and coders who fancied having a nice hardware platform with a powerful chip inside it (like me!) , and didn't really make sense to guitarists. As you say, you'd want a dock to go with every module. Otherwise, you've got some module you can't use, or can only use when you're not using something else. Doesn't make much sense.

[Mark Hammer]

1) The biggest impediment to the success of the series was really the weight and size of the docks.  When you consider the plethora of lightweight 1590A-sized pedals out there (and I saw this morning that Menatone has pretty well ported their entire line over to the "mini" form-factor, and MXR has released a Bluebox derivative in mini form), who is going to stick a 5lb pedal on their board?  That Achilles heel aside, the idea was VERY clever for its time.  In particular, the idea that two standardized docks (mono and stereo) could be built and serve for the entire line of effects, provided tremendous convenience from a manufacturer's perspective.  Why they chose to go with such a heavy and costly chassis is anybody's guess.

2) I swear by Stabilant 22 as a way of keeping contacts alive.  I have resurrected the contacts on well-used TV remotes, Nintendo cartridges, and SIM-card connectors with the stuff.  As I am fond of repeating, in the land of electrons, one micron may as well be the Grand Canyon.  Stabilant forms a viscous electroconductive "web" between edge connectors and sockets, and what plugs into them.

3) The footswitches were an elegant idea, packing two functions into one treadle.  The mechanism used height-staggered microswitches, that allowed light presses to do one thing (generally tap-tempo or other secondary functions), and hard-click presses to do bypass/engagement.  The "click" came from a flexible concave disk that would give when pressed hard enough, and then snap back into place when the treadle was released.  I will note one exception that I encountered.  One of the docks that Jeorge Tripps sent me was very reluctant to work.   Knowing that I had other docks I could use in case I buggered this one up, I took it apart completely, and discovered that during construction two discs had stuck to each other, by virtue of the thin oil coating, such that it would not bend.  I separated them, re-installed one of them, and the pedal came back to life, with full switching restored.

[roseblood11]

This guy managed to repair an Echo Park module by re-programming the flash memory. There's a download for the program code at the bottom of the page.
http://falseelectronics.blogspot.com/2017/07/line-6-echo-park.html?m=1

The flash memory is a SST25F512.

If someone is able to program that IC:
Please send me a PM!

[potul]

I would try to get one of those cheap CH341A  programmers. They should work with a "25 style" SPI flash memory.
I haven't done it myself, I've programmed only "24" I2C memories with it, but it's a cheap try you could do.

[potul]

Or, if you have an arduino, you can use this tutorial:

https://learn.adafruit.com/programming-spi-flash-prom-with-an-ft232h-breakout

[roseblood11]

Played around with my Echo Park again.
I can't find the error.

The dock is 100% working. It works perfectly with other modules and even with the Echo Park module, the clean signal is always there and it's pathing tap tempo information.

The delay itself is working, but it makes strange noises instead of exact repeats. There are audible repeats, but very slow, and it sounds, as if someone is constantly turning pots. The pitch is constantly changing, like when you turn the "time" knob. I cleaned the pots and switches a hundred times with de-oxit and tuner600, I resoldered them, I swapped the electrolytic cap on the module pcb. I cleaned the contacts that connect the module and the dock and I pushed a piece of plastic in the small gap to have more pressure at that point.
But nothing changes.

What could I try next? Replace all the pots and switches and see what happens?

[daxproduck]

I've got a dead echo park.  No signal, even in bypass.  Dock works with my compressor module so I'm pretty convinced its the actual module.

Led flashes green-red-red when you stomp it.  Then nothing.  Would love to get that schematic!!