someone upped this on "another" forum...worth a look!!!!!

[pinkjimiphoton]

but....if we build it,....it will be done!

[R.G.]

If you guys have this much determination to build one of these, it might make a great intro to PCB layout for one or more of you.

The board sketches show where mounting holes and wire connections go, and also have the parts placed. Given that, and that you know that this arrangement of parts has already resulted in a working unit, if you just place parts in the same relative positions, you should be able to connect the traces without too much of a problem. The schematic tells you what connects to what, the board sketch tells you where the points are that will be connected. All you need to do is run the traces.

If I were doing this, I'd take a drawing/photo program and scale up the parts placement diagrams to as close to real size as I could guess at. Perfection is not needed because no ICs with their locked-in lead spacing are used as I remember. Then I'd lock that layer and add another drawing layer over the diagram, and start putting in pads and traces.

It's a good beginner's exercise, if a bit extensive; not too tricky. If you've never done anything like this, it'll take a couple of afternoons. If you're experienced in basic layout, one afternoon should do.

[pinkjimiphoton]

that's an awesome idea, rg...is there a program you'd reccomend for doing this kind of graphic work?

i really wanna try and make this happen...it would be cool if we could produce a work/soundalike for a 100 or 200$.

i bet it really wouldn't be all that hard to do, i realize it would put a dent in the vintage prices. but...as often happens cuz of the diy community,
the diy forum version may actually IMPROVE slightly on the original design...we have a lot of options that plain weren't available in the early 70's!!

[Top Top]

Is this the pedal used on sonic youth's "diamond sea"?

I believe I've seen one once -- under thurston moore's foot.

[pinkjimiphoton]

yep, that's it

[wavley]

Yep,

Somewhere I have a single with the 28 minute version where he really digs into it.

Saw them like six times on that tour/the lollapalooza tour.  It really was their last truly great record in my opinion, not that I don't dig the records after that, they seem to flirt with being good and then they let Kim sing some nonsense, I love her and all, but save that silly crap for Free Kitten.

[Top Top]

Yep,

Somewhere I have a single with the 28 minute version where he really digs into it.

Saw them like six times on that tour/the lollapalooza tour.  It really was their last truly great record in my opinion, not that I don't dig the records after that, they seem to flirt with being good and then they let Kim sing some nonsense, I love her and all, but save that silly crap for Free Kitten.

Ooh, ouch.
Personally, I like their early stuff, then they lose me in the late 80's/early 90's -- daydream nation, goo, dirty (I know this is where most people love them), and then I get more into their Experimental Jet Set...  and after stuff. Washing Machine is one of my favorites though.

I haven't followed them super closely since maybe about 2000 or so, but I have heard stuff I liked all along the way. Last I saw them was in 2004 or 5 I think when some friends' band toured with them, and it was as good as I've ever seen them, IMO. Played with Thurston's Aktion unit once too and it ripped. I've got major respect for the whole SY crew and how they have kept it real over the years.

[Jazznoise]

Didn't know that about Diamond Sea! The 28 minute version is on The Destroyed Room. That makes me want to play with this..you bastards 

To be honest the only records of theirs I'm not mad about are NYC: Ghosts And Flowers and A Thousand Leaves  - and I'm only negative towards A Thousand Leaves because of French Tickler. I hate it that much. Drowning The Snake was also such a bad song it put me off their last album for ages! Kim has that sort of vibe, but sometimes she gets nails it. Still, it's an awful thing when noise fans find your singing abit too caustic...

[wavley]

Yep,

Somewhere I have a single with the 28 minute version where he really digs into it.

Saw them like six times on that tour/the lollapalooza tour.  It really was their last truly great record in my opinion, not that I don't dig the records after that, they seem to flirt with being good and then they let Kim sing some nonsense, I love her and all, but save that silly crap for Free Kitten.

Ooh, ouch.
Personally, I like their early stuff, then they lose me in the late 80's/early 90's -- daydream nation, goo, dirty (I know this is where most people love them), and then I get more into their Experimental Jet Set...  and after stuff. Washing Machine is one of my favorites though.

I haven't followed them super closely since maybe about 2000 or so, but I have heard stuff I liked all along the way. Last I saw them was in 2004 or 5 I think when some friends' band toured with them, and it was as good as I've ever seen them, IMO. Played with Thurston's Aktion unit once too and it ripped. I've got major respect for the whole SY crew and how they have kept it real over the years.

I like the early stuff the best too, it can't be touched.  I've seen them every tour since Goo (I was a little young for anything but skating to their records before that), did some crazy things like fly to Toronto from Tampa or drive to Chicago to see the Daydream Nation (Pitchfork Festival) show for my honeymoon.  I don't know, the last few times I've seen them they seemed bitter and trying to hold on to some kind of teen angst, I guess in an effort to bring young kids in to the fold, kind of like when Aerosmith got Diane Warren to write songs for them.  I wish they would just embrace the fact that they are middle age and be themselves.  Of course this is just my opinion, I was playing with some guys not too long ago that were huge fans (but 10 years younger than me) and they were going through my LPs and didn't recognize anything Pre-Goo, Experimental is what started it for them.  Maybe my opinion is based on ME being an old guy and projecting a bit  

Big SST Sister Poster in my studio...


Sorry to derail the thread, back to Ludwig

[wavley]

Didn't know that about Diamond Sea! The 28 minute version is on The Destroyed Room. That makes me want to play with this..you bastards 

To be honest the only records of theirs I'm not mad about are NYC: Ghosts And Flowers and A Thousand Leaves  - and I'm only negative towards A Thousand Leaves because of French Tickler. I hate it that much. Drowning The Snake was also such a bad song it put me off their last album for ages! Kim has that sort of vibe, but sometimes she gets nails it. Still, it's an awful thing when noise fans find your singing abit too caustic...

Same here, there are songs on those records that I like, but the bad ones are just soooo baaaddd.  I really like Murray St and the new one, but it kind of seems like the spark that made it arty is gone, maybe it's just me.  I did see them play a three hour fan show on the NYC Ghosts tour at a bar under a different name (Perspectives Musicales) where they all played solo sets to open and it was AWESOME!!  They sucked the next night opening for Pearl Jam, but that was more the crowd's fault.

I forgot that track is on destroyed room, I resent that record a little for making all of my scouring record stores for 7" and 12" singles and ep's for years not so special anymore, but actually I'm glad that folks can get hold of that stuff now.  I've always thought that Genetic was one of their best songs and they put that on the remaster.

[Keppy]

Thanks Top Top! I knew someone would find a clip! That thing sounds awesome!

Now, before any of us attempt a layout per R.G.'s suggestion, can anyone confirm that the original is a single-sided board rather than double-sided? Finding out halfway through making a layout would be a nasty surprise...

[pinkjimiphoton]

it was indeed a single sided board. i don't think double sided really started happening til the late 70's/early 80's.
like i said, i did open mine up back about 1980 or so and looked inside. i think the only thing we won't be able to replicate is the colour changing switches.

btw...i believe steve howe used one of these on the album topographic oceans, as there's one song on there that completely nailed the tone of the phase II.
sorry, been too many years since i heard it to remember the name, but i believe it was in d, if that makes any difference.

this pedal is capable of ALOT of different sounds. the talking vowel thing is a gas, but the phaser is, too, as is the fuzz. and it has enough output to open and close vco and vcf's, too, for the analog synth set. i remember wiring it up to a friends arp 2600, and it was pretty intense. i didn't know at the time what he did or how he hooked it up, all i know was it allowed that big 2600 to become about the coolest guitar pedal in the world.

[Jazznoise]

I loved Murray St. and Sonic Nurse, I did think they were coming of age albums too tbh. Idk what's up with The Eternal..

ANYWAY! This SY fanboyism is off topic (even if I'd have never gotten into this before em) and will not generate delicious phaser. Though his project is WAYYY above my current level. But I'm excited by the idea of people trying to build this, considering the component cost and workload. Though I imagine a little modern ingenuity could be used to scale it down. IC usage, more modern transistors (read: less leaky transistors). I can see why there isn't a million of these floating around considering what they made it with!

I'm also surprised by the number of phase stages, these fancy pedals always make you think there'll be a bazillion of them!

[pinkjimiphoton]

i forget, but i believe there were maybe 1000 of these units made in toto. they really weren't that popular, which is why most ended up in high school electronic music programs. back then, peeps didn't play guitar thru them so much, they fed oscillators and tape thru them to create as then unheard sounds. the one i had had apparently never even been plugged in according to my old hs band director, and had sat in a corner of the office untouched since around 1970. i got it about 10 years later, as it was slated to be junked.
THAT would have been a shame!!!!

[wavley]

I loved Murray St. and Sonic Nurse, I did think they were coming of age albums too tbh. Idk what's up with The Eternal..

ANYWAY! This SY fanboyism is off topic (even if I'd have never gotten into this before em) and will not generate delicious phaser. Though his project is WAYYY above my current level. But I'm excited by the idea of people trying to build this, considering the component cost and workload. Though I imagine a little modern ingenuity could be used to scale it down. IC usage, more modern transistors (read: less leaky transistors). I can see why there isn't a million of these floating around considering what they made it with!

I'm also surprised by the number of phase stages, these fancy pedals always make you think there'll be a bazillion of them!

Sorry, didn't mean to go all fanboy got a little overzealous and excited because I live in the country now, not many peeps to talk good music with.

Tales has some of my favorite Howe tones!

Maybe board mounted switches would be good for this thing.

[glops]

Sorry to go back to Sonic Youth. Their soundtrack to this, Simon Werner a Disparu (aka Lights Out), is really great.  I didn't care for their last studio album but still like them a lot.  There were some nice moments on Sonic Nurse and the one after that.  I still listen to Goo, Daydream, and Sister a lot.  That soundtrack is lovely, though...

[Ry]

Hey guys, I found the drawings of the switches and a couple of email chains about them.  I need to get them scanned, at which point I will post them (probably on Friday).

[pinkjimiphoton]

awesome, can't wait to see that stuff....i'm really psyched how everyone is pulling together to make this happen.
speaks volumes about the charachter of the people on this forum!!!

[MoltenVoltage]

Thanks Top Top! I knew someone would find a clip! That thing sounds awesome!

Now, before any of us attempt a layout per R.G.'s suggestion, can anyone confirm that the original is a single-sided board rather than double-sided? Finding out halfway through making a layout would be a nasty surprise...

Look at the original schematic/layout and you will see there are a number of jumper wires on the top of the PCB

In action:

[pinkjimiphoton]

ok, i hit the search function....here's what i could find that seemed relevant...we're slowly getting closer!!!!!!!












guys, this is too damn wack, but i believe these pics are of my old ludwig...i mean, what are the odds of another one where the same damn switch
had broken, and been replaced??  f*** me, small world...







http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=62567.0

http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=19199.0