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mother@#$%ing tonepad phase 45... :(

Started by deadastronaut, June 02, 2011, 08:06:55 AM

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deadastronaut

June 02, 2011, 08:06:55 AM Last Edit: June 02, 2011, 08:17:00 AM by deadastronaut
ok built another phase 45...tonepad...as i did ages ago...

turned fets around...had a cup of tea...tried various orientations....hmmmmm...had a cigarette...looked at my cat....

tried 2n5952,j201,mpf102's....no phasing....got signal going through fine.....250k trim isnt doing anything though!.....ARGHHHHHHH.....

IF I DONT GET IT GOING TODAY I'M GOING TO ATTACK MY CAT!...HELP OR THE CAT GETS IT..!!!!!.. or it'll be your fault... ;D

one thing, i have used a 4.7v  zener diode...but not a 1n5230 specifically... ::)...shouldnt make a difference though should it?...

http://www.tonepad.com/getFile.asp?id=70

p.s: any mention of the 'debugging thread' will result in the cat being instantly attacked... :icon_twisted:

https://www.youtube.com/user/100roberthenry
https://deadastronaut.wixsite.com/effects

chasm reverb/tremshifter/faze filter/abductor II delay/timestream reverb/dreamtime delay/skinwalker hi gain dist/black triangle OD/ nano drums/space patrol fuzz//

bean

#1
June 02, 2011, 08:27:16 AM
You didn't mention: did you match up your FETs at all? I did this with my build and it worked right away.

frequencycentral

#2
June 02, 2011, 08:29:17 AM
Matched yer FETs? I just got through matching a batch of 200 x 5485. My fingers are actually blackened from the littel fkrs.

4.7v zener should be fine.

Chances are it's a dumb human error kinda thing.

Have you tried the debugging thread? (I'm allergic to cats)
http://www.frequencycentral.co.uk/

Questo è il fiore del partigiano morto per la libertà!

deadastronaut

#3
June 02, 2011, 08:33:36 AM
RIGHT THE CATS GETTING IT.... :icon_twisted: :icon_mrgreen:

after i go through ALL my fets...ARGHHHHHHHHHHHHH.........so the nearest match should do it then?...

i only have 2x 2n5952's.....

lots of j201's

and mpf102's...
https://www.youtube.com/user/100roberthenry
https://deadastronaut.wixsite.com/effects

chasm reverb/tremshifter/faze filter/abductor II delay/timestream reverb/dreamtime delay/skinwalker hi gain dist/black triangle OD/ nano drums/space patrol fuzz//

Govmnt_Lacky

#4
June 02, 2011, 08:34:53 AM
I see a couple jumpers in there...... Are they, ya' know....... IN THERE??
A Veteran is someone who, at one point in his or her life, wrote a blank check made payable to The United States of America
for an amount of 'up to and including my life.'

R.G.

#5
June 02, 2011, 08:36:08 AM
Quote from: deadastronaut on June 02, 2011, 08:06:55 AM
p.s: any mention of the 'debugging thread' will result in the cat being instantly attacked... :icon_twisted:
We have a barn cat here. He periodically brings us small animals he's killed. Some of them are bigger than he is.

He's lying here grinning at the idea that a human might attack a cat...  :icon_biggrin:
R.G.

In response to the questions in the forum - PCB Layout for Musical Effects is available from The Book Patch. Search "PCB Layout" and it ought to appear.

frequencycentral

#6
June 02, 2011, 08:37:48 AM
IIR I found the best Vgs was -1.5v or thereabouts. Matched within ~0.2v ideally. As there are only 2 FETs, the matching is less forgiving than with higher FET count phasers.
http://www.frequencycentral.co.uk/

Questo è il fiore del partigiano morto per la libertà!

deadastronaut

#7
June 02, 2011, 08:42:59 AM
@govlacky... yep got em..

@RG...sounds like a cool cat..

@rick. okey dokey....i'll go through em and see which are near it...

my cat has had a reprieve...for a little while!... :icon_evil:
https://www.youtube.com/user/100roberthenry
https://deadastronaut.wixsite.com/effects

chasm reverb/tremshifter/faze filter/abductor II delay/timestream reverb/dreamtime delay/skinwalker hi gain dist/black triangle OD/ nano drums/space patrol fuzz//

p_wats

#8
June 02, 2011, 08:48:56 AM
When I built mine I had to flip the transistors from the way they were oriented in the layout. Not sure if it's been fixed.

deadastronaut

#9
June 02, 2011, 08:52:07 AM
Quote from: p_wats on June 02, 2011, 08:48:56 AM
When I built mine I had to flip the transistors from the way they were oriented in the layout. Not sure if it's been fixed.

nope it hasnt!.... ::)
https://www.youtube.com/user/100roberthenry
https://deadastronaut.wixsite.com/effects

chasm reverb/tremshifter/faze filter/abductor II delay/timestream reverb/dreamtime delay/skinwalker hi gain dist/black triangle OD/ nano drums/space patrol fuzz//

Govmnt_Lacky

#10
June 02, 2011, 08:56:18 AM
Quote from: deadastronaut on June 02, 2011, 08:52:07 AM
Quote from: p_wats on June 02, 2011, 08:48:56 AM
When I built mine I had to flip the transistors from the way they were oriented in the layout. Not sure if it's been fixed.

nope it hasnt!.... ::)

I greatly appreciate the projects that Fransisco provides over on Tonepad but there have been no updates to the site (as far as perojects go) in a LONG TIME. I hope that he finds some time to make these minor corrections. Might get rid of some of the problems that are seen here.

My 2.....  :icon_rolleyes:
A Veteran is someone who, at one point in his or her life, wrote a blank check made payable to The United States of America
for an amount of 'up to and including my life.'

deadastronaut

#11
June 02, 2011, 08:59:13 AM
yep agreed.


hmm... just to be sure i'm measuring these correctly...

i have a dmm with transistor tester on it....4 holes....E B C E..(set on NPN) ..i'm trying the fets in the B C E  sockets and getting readings ranging

from 154-210....with j201's...this is right isnt it?..i just want to be sure!... ::)


hmmmm the cats looking worried... :icon_twisted:
https://www.youtube.com/user/100roberthenry
https://deadastronaut.wixsite.com/effects

chasm reverb/tremshifter/faze filter/abductor II delay/timestream reverb/dreamtime delay/skinwalker hi gain dist/black triangle OD/ nano drums/space patrol fuzz//

frequencycentral

#12
June 02, 2011, 09:04:25 AM
Geofex FET match fixture: http://www.geofex.com/Article_Folders/fetmatch/fetmatch.gif

Circumstances in which it's acceptable to blame the cat:


  • The cat designed the Phase 45
  • The cat made the layout
  • The cat soldered the circuit
  • The cat matched the FETs

Not an exhaustive list, there may be more, maybe we can start a wiki.
http://www.frequencycentral.co.uk/

Questo è il fiore del partigiano morto per la libertà!

R.G.

#13
June 02, 2011, 09:10:48 AM
Quote from: deadastronaut on June 02, 2011, 08:59:13 AM
just to be sure i'm measuring these correctly...
i have a dmm with transistor tester on it....4 holes....E B C E..(set on NPN) ..i'm trying the fets in the B C E  sockets and getting readings ranging
from 154-210....with j201's...this is right isnt it?..i just want to be sure!... ::)
JFETs don't have current gains like NPNs do. That test tells you nothing useful.

J201s are unusual JFETs. They are OK for what they do, but they are not the best JFET for something like a JFET phaser, although they can work, I hear.

I'm going to go ahead and hack you off. The reason the questions in "what to do when it doesn't work" are there is that the information is so very, very effective on most problems. And although it seems like advice for a newbie, I give myself that same advice when I'm trying to find out what my latest thing doesn't work. Going through measuring all that stuff again mechanically forces  you to find things that you'd overlook otherwise. Measuring everything means that you don't miss something that you "know" is already right. Same as having people tell you that you have to check the pinout of your JFETs against a data sheet again.
R.G.

In response to the questions in the forum - PCB Layout for Musical Effects is available from The Book Patch. Search "PCB Layout" and it ought to appear.

boogietone

#14
June 02, 2011, 09:14:02 AM
We have a wild cat the takes care of mice in the field behind the house. My wife calls it the goat. I am not sure why.
An oxymoron - clean transistor boost.

deadastronaut

#15
June 02, 2011, 09:24:02 AM
 so ive got to build a fet matcher then...ok!...but the cats getting very very nervous now... :icon_eek:

as a matter of course!..

here are my voltages on the 2x tl072's...

left opamp.

pin 1   3.10
pin 2  3.10
pin3   3.10
pin4   0.00
pin5   2.96
pin6   3.10
pin7  3.10
pin8  9.08

right opamp.

pin1    8.45
pin2    5.8-3.5...variable..
pin3    5.79
pin4  0.00
pin5  3.10
pin6   3.10
pin7  3.10
pin 8  9.08

@boogietone...strange!... ;D
https://www.youtube.com/user/100roberthenry
https://deadastronaut.wixsite.com/effects

chasm reverb/tremshifter/faze filter/abductor II delay/timestream reverb/dreamtime delay/skinwalker hi gain dist/black triangle OD/ nano drums/space patrol fuzz//

deadastronaut

#16
June 02, 2011, 09:32:53 AM
https://www.youtube.com/user/100roberthenry
https://deadastronaut.wixsite.com/effects

chasm reverb/tremshifter/faze filter/abductor II delay/timestream reverb/dreamtime delay/skinwalker hi gain dist/black triangle OD/ nano drums/space patrol fuzz//

DougH

#17
June 02, 2011, 09:36:46 AM
"I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you."

deadastronaut

#18
June 02, 2011, 09:38:29 AM Last Edit: June 02, 2011, 09:44:54 AM by deadastronaut
^ LOL.....his face!...ha ha.... :icon_mrgreen:


edit: ok i'll have a go at knocking up a quick vero of the fet matcher...i'm sure it'll be usefull to others too....thanks guys!..back in a bit!..
https://www.youtube.com/user/100roberthenry
https://deadastronaut.wixsite.com/effects

chasm reverb/tremshifter/faze filter/abductor II delay/timestream reverb/dreamtime delay/skinwalker hi gain dist/black triangle OD/ nano drums/space patrol fuzz//

p_wats

#19
June 02, 2011, 09:44:33 AM
I can also definitely say that I didn't match any Fets and mine sounds great. Might have gotten lucky.
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