Powder coating labels? Another 'paint a enclosure' thread.

[add4]

So i'm thinking of buying a basic powder coating kit to try to get a nice finish for the boxes. I've heard that it's the best finish around and that it's quite fast to do.
I'm wondering if it's possible to do labels with powder coating too with a second layer of powder using a stencil or something like that.
Has anyone ever tried that?
The goal would be to have a kind of mxr finish : the color is powder coating i think, and the labels seem to be another layer of paint, so i thought i could be done.
Another question : if you powder coat, you don't HAVE to finish with a laquer, right? but you would have to do it if you use sticker labels, right again?

Thanks for your input

p.s.
YES, i did search for it on the forum, no, i couldn't find a relevant thread about that particular subject ^^

[Processaurus]

You bake powder coat, so unfortunately you couldn't use anything as a label that would bubble/burn/get weird in the oven... clear powder coat over a stencil or screenprint or handpainted labeling would look great though.

[Ice-9]

I bought a poweder coating kit ages ago and posted a tutorial on these very forums. the reason I wanted powder coat for pedals was I didn't want to have long prep and drying times associated with paint, I wanted tough durability of the finished box and I didn't want to have to laquer the box either.

Now after a long time playing I have found the best way for me is to powder coat the pedal, then with my home made screen printing kit apply my graphics. With the correct screen printing inks there is no need to laquer afterwards. Boss and MXR pedals look like there painter then screen printed with no laquer.

I should do an updated tutorial that covers powder coating and screen printing as it was a while ago that i done these, but it will have to wait for my next build. For now I will see if I can find a link to the tuts I did previously.

[Mike Burgundy]

I guess it's possible to use cut-out stencils/decals/whachummacallit to apply powder only where you want it (the letters) but you'd have to remove the stencil before baking without disturbing the unbaked powder - I imagine that could be a major headache. Powdercoating and applying lettering afterwards gives a very durable finish (they never seem to chip where the letters are after all, but on the corners) with all the flexibility of your lettering system of choice.
I'm amazed you can do powdercoat, and chrome, black chrome, heck, gold-plating! at home nowadays. Don't know if I have the guts to shell out for something like that and try it, but it sure looks fascinating! Anyone ever tried any of the caswell stuff?

[add4]

I bought a poweder coating kit ages ago and posted a tutorial on these very forums. the reason I wanted powder coat for pedals was I didn't want to have long prep and drying times associated with paint, I wanted tough durability of the finished box and I didn't want to have to laquer the box either.

Now after a long time playing I have found the best way for me is to powder coat the pedal, then with my home made screen printing kit apply my graphics. With the correct screen printing inks there is no need to laquer afterwards. Boss and MXR pedals look like there painter then screen printed with no laquer.

I should do an updated tutorial that covers powder coating and screen printing as it was a while ago that i done these, but it will have to wait for my next build. For now I will see if I can find a link to the tuts I did previously.

That's very interesting. I never heard about that screen painting technique before.
I have the same reason for choosing powder coating, starter kits are around 70$ and you can get a small compressor for 20 bucks too so it's a decent price to get a nice finished box
I would be very interested about the screen printing tutorial and if you can't do it soon, some links or references to what are the correct paints for metal, how to make a starter kit, hot to make a stencil for screen printing, stuff like that.

What are the other options for printing labels? Inkjet or laser printing on transparent decals? then you have to laquer over it i guess..

My first attempts at lacquering led to yellowish laquer (polyurethane), and i chipped the paint and laquer very easily with a screwdriver while mounting the box.
Plus as can't use spray cans at home (i live in a flat) i used brushes to coat the box and the surface wasn't prefect even if i baked it.

I'd be interested in any solution to do labeling without applying another coat of something above it to make it last, preferably something that can be designed on computer then painlessly applied on the box.

Any other thoughts? any precision on screen painting?

[armstrom]

Yes, it is possible to do exactly what you want.. with some careful selection of materials...

First, buy normal powder for your base coat. Most powders cure at around 400 degrees F. Apply your powder base coat normally and cure it.

Next, you need to use a bake-on decal (not a normal water slide). These work just like laser water slide decals. You print on the decal paper, soak in water to separate from the carrier paper and  slide it on to your part. Once the decal has dried you bake it at a 345 degrees for 15 min. Since this is below the reflow temperature of most powders you won't ruin your initial coat.

Finally, apply a low-temperature clear powder. I bought some clear powder that cures at only 325 degrees.

So, as you can see, if you pick your materials correctly you are always curing subsequent coats at lower temps than the previous coats.  Here's a picture of a pedal enclosure I did. Note, this is JUST the base and a bake-on decal. I did not apply the clear coat to this particular pedal.



Here are the sources I used for my materials:
Bake-on laser decal stock: http://www.papilio.com/laser%20bake%20on%20water%20slide%20decal%20paper.html
Low-temp clear powder: http://www.powderbuythepound.com/DIAMOND_ACRYLIC_CLEAR.html

One thing I have NOT tried yet (it may not be possible) is to reverse my decal image and put the decal on upside down before I bake it. That would trap the layer of toner between the base powder coat layer and the clear resin of the decal itself. The decal cures to a pretty hard surface as it is. I'm just not sure if the decal material is the same on both sides. I will have to do a test run.

Good luck!
-Matt

[tiges_ tendres]

No to be contrary to the previous poster, but you can do waterslides and powder coat over the top without yellowing or curling.  You just have to wait a while for all the water to evaporate.

Here is an example:






However, those bake on decals look way better and dont require a clear coat.  I just happened to have waterslides to hand.

[jimmybjj]

+1 i just use regular laser watersides. i don't even wait, i just apply and wipe dry with paper towel then clear coat.

[blooze_man]

LOVE the EweTube!

[add4]

Guys, that looks EXACTLY like the finish i'd like to obtain! thanks for showing me that! Is the background color of the ewe tube powder coat too? they all look amazingly professional!
i was not aware of these bake-on decal, and even less aware of the clear coat powder. thanks for this information!
Would that also work with inkjet waterside decals? i had a look around and it seems the inkjet ink is much more sensitive to heat and gets brownish at 300F, which is too low for the temperature controlled clear powder to melt. Anyone tried this anyway, with any luck? i only have an inkjet (new! ... duh!) printer at home.
I have an oven that is already killed by polyurethane baking so i should really jump that step and buy the powder coating material I guess.

Any comment/thoughts on the kits available? are the cheap ones (harbor freight, eastwood) ok for painting such small things as our enclosures?
Any comments about powder coating inside? is it a mess? The best i could do in the place I live would be using a big box i used when i moved in my flat, to remove one side, and to cover the other sides with plastic bags , then to use that to powder things in, with windows opened. Would I make a mess in the room? would i die from not enough having enough fresh air?
Is it ok to buy the smallest compressor available if i'm just painting one/two boxes at a time?
Thanks for your very interesting input
Arnaud

[tiges_ tendres]

Guys, that looks EXACTLY like the finish i'd like to obtain! thanks for showing me that! Is the background color of the ewe tube powder coat too? they all look amazingly professional!
i was not aware of these bake-on decal, and even less aware of the clear coat powder. thanks for this information!
Would that also work with inkjet waterside decals? i had a look around and it seems the inkjet ink is much more sensitive to heat and gets brownish at 300F, which is too low for the temperature controlled clear powder to melt. Anyone tried this anyway, with any luck? i only have an inkjet (new! ... duh!) printer at home.
I have an oven that is already killed by polyurethane baking so i should really jump that step and buy the powder coating material I guess.

Any comment/thoughts on the kits available? are the cheap ones (harbor freight, eastwood) ok for painting such small things as our enclosures?
Any comments about powder coating inside? is it a mess? The best i could do in the place I live would be using a big box i used when i moved in my flat, to remove one side, and to cover the other sides with plastic bags , then to use that to powder things in, with windows opened. Would I make a mess in the room? would i die from not enough having enough fresh air?
Is it ok to buy the smallest compressor available if i'm just painting one/two boxes at a time?
Thanks for your very interesting input
Arnaud

Powder coating is messy.  Really messy.  Particles get in the air and land on everything.  My entire garage has a light film of powder on it!  You really need space to work.  Outside is best, unless you have a designated, large area. I had the idea of a little spray booth, but to cover all the parts of the box, you really need a larger area than the tiny booth can offer.

I use a Harbor Freight gun, and it broke immediately!  Fortunately I was able to fix it.  There's a copper braid in the handle area that is part of the grounding.  That broke, but was easy to fix.  I never liked the Eastwood gun because of the way the trigger was set up.  I know you can use it one handed, but I much prefer the foot controlled operation of the HF one.  I also find the Eastwood powder a little pricey.

If you do go with the HF gun, don't bother with the HF powder, get some good powder from Powderbuythepound.com or Columbia Coatings.

As for the compressor, if you buy a small one, it will just keep switching on to fill back up.  The cheap ones also tend to be really noisy.  So if you're cool with a loud compressor, then go for it.

[jimmybjj]

Yes, the ewetube is all powder coat. Dormant orange and clear.

[add4]

Does anyone know where i could find a powder coating gun in europe?
i tried to buy those from amazon.com but they won't ship it to europe. and i don't find those on other sites
Anyone ever overcome these limitations?
I would try ebay, but the shipping prices are more important than the gun itself (gives an excuse to go for a better gun , i know, but i'd like to keep the budget tight).
The ideal thing would be to find an european company that makes and sell powder coating systems.
I've been googling around heavily, but haven't found that yet. Any ideas?
Peace,
Arnaud

[markeebee]

Powder coating kit in UK:

http://www.electrostaticmagic.co.uk/

I was thinking about this after reading Ice-9's tutorial a while back, but I concluded that I don't make enough boxes to justify the expense.  The kit is cheaper now, might have to think again.

[add4]

Just ordered the gun
Another question : when i clear coat the labels using spray can, i always clearly see the shape of the decals on the pedal.
How do you guys do to get a perfectly flat surface on the pedal, even with the decals?

Thanks

[deadastronaut]

decal the whole face up to the edges....or you will see the lip...no matter how thin..

[add4]

Then how do you cut neatly the decal into the pot and switches holes?
very carefully with a precision knife after it has been placed? like cutting it in a cross and bending it into the pedal? cutting a prefect round edge means ripping off from time to time and ruining the decal, right?

[deadastronaut]

yep,thats how i did it...try and cut them out though, otherwise they'll push up and possibly lift your decal when you push your pots etc through...

i only etch now...i can't bear inevitable chips etc...

[add4]

Etch?
The aluminum etching cool thing i saw on a gallery in this site? That sounds cool, but in the end, are your label colored?
and your box is only aluminum colored then?
I tried to get a really soft looking aluminum box but it seems my sandpaper is not fine enough, i can always see the pattern of the sanding really clearly. i should try and buy a whole set of sandpaper one of these days.
Sorry about the noob questions ... i'm a noob : )

[deadastronaut]

Etch?
The aluminum etching cool thing i saw on a gallery in this site? That sounds cool, but in the end, are your label colored?
and your box is only aluminum colored then?
I tried to get a really soft looking aluminum box but it seems my sandpaper is not fine enough, i can always see the pattern of the sanding really clearly. i should try and buy a whole set of sandpaper one of these days.
Sorry about the noob questions ... i'm a noob : )

you paint the etched part any colour you like...checkout etched enclosures thread.. rick uses various colours...i use black mostly...

http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=85803.0