help in creating veroboard layouts

[mordechai]

I find veroboards a little difficult to follow and figure out.  I'd like to try building on one, but I'm wondering if there's a software program that can take a schematic and help translate it into a veroboard layout in a manner similar to what Eagle does with PCB production.  Any suggestions?

[Seljer]

I just use Eagle, I just try to prioritize creating all connections and traces in the same direction when positioning components and usually end up with fairly compact layouts. I also run any connections perpendicular to the traces as "top layer" to remind me that they're jumpers when actually building the board

[deadastronaut]

i used to like vero, but now i hate it...i can get a much better, and smaller layout doing pcb with diylc v3...its easier to see how its working, and to lay out from a schematic

than vero's...a bit more work to etch/drill etc, but well worth it imo...

[mordechai]

i used to like vero, but now i hate it...i can get a much better, and smaller layout doing pcb with diylc v3...its easier to see how its working, and to lay out from a schematic

than vero's...a bit more work to etch/drill etc, but well worth it imo...

I'm not familiar with diylc v3.  Is there a URL to which you can direct me where I can download it or get a tutorial on how to use it?

[mordechai]

Nevermind -- I just found it and downloaded it, but don't really know how to get started.  I'd like to draw a schematic and then, like eagle, build a PCB or veroboard layout from it.  Can anyone suggest a tutorial that can help me learn to do this on the DIYLC program?

[deadastronaut]

theres no tutorial as such....

try a simple fuzz schematic to pcb first...work from input/left to right output...it takes a little practice but it gets easier, and more obvious,

as long as you are connecting all the 'nodes' 'connections' you'll be fine...

treat the top as positive...and bottom as negative is a good place to start...have fun!..

[mordechai]

Well, the problem is that I don't even know how to start.  I have the program downloaded, I open it, there's a grid pattern on the screen but I don't see the options for how to draw a schematic, let alone how to translate the schematic into a layout as one would do in Eagle for a PCB...I know this must sound like such a dumb problem, but for a first timer without a clue, this is a bit overwhelming.

Any help on how to get started would be very appreciated!!

[deadastronaut]

OK. all your components are at the top, create a board...then drag components on it, and add connectivity...

heres what i do, i use the 'misc add image' and import the schematic image alongside my 'board' then go left to right adding parts..

heres a quick example of 'starting off' ok...hope this gives some idea...it takes a while to get used to, but its worth it in the end...

note the 10k, going to collector, input going to 0.1uf going to base, and emitter going to ground....use 3 hole spacing for caps, and 4 hole for resistors, so the parts can fit...its in actual scale..

[mordechai]

That is a big help, thank you.  Is the schematic on the right something you generated independent of DIYLC, or is it something you created in thje program and it, in turn, generated the component icons for the layout (like in Eagle)?  If the former, then you're just referencing the schematic by eye while building the board layout, correct?

[deadastronaut]

no, its a schematic by rick holt (frequency central) i was just using that as an example...

but yeah its a good idea to import the schematic to have as a reference, and saves flipping back n forth between windows...plus it gets saved with your work too...



it wont generate anything, you have to design it manually....

i start with a board the correct size for a box.. e.g :  1590b 21holes across...etc...then make it fit, or go smaller..

[Renegadrian]

I am a big Vero user, and I really like to do a lot of layouts (just see my folder in the gallery..)
I quite disagree with deadastronaut then, but yeah everyone's different, you just have to find the tools that let you work the best...this applies for layouts softwares too, the tool is nothing without a good user...
You have to create layouts by yourself, diylc only helps you on the graphic side...
Now I use gimp and some components images I found, that means I cut and paste components' images on a blank vero board...it takes a while, but I reached a good point of perfection (humbly sayin'... )
it's just like sudoku!!! Or even better!!! 

[deadastronaut]

I quite disagree with deadastronaut
l:

thats not allowed...

: renegadrian does do great vero's...

[pedalgrinder]

find a program you can use that has a auto route function on it. It will be your best friend trust me. I fought with vero for years you miss one wire one cut all over hours of fault finding till you spot it.

[Seljer]

Here is what I was talking about earlier about using Eagle to layout things for veroboard



I prioritze making all connections on the same horizontal lines. I also don't commit to having all resistors laying flat, I don't have any issues against spanning only 2 or 3 holes, same applies for other components. Any jumpers and such I place on the top layer.

You have to figure out where to cuts the traces in the end by yourself (and double check twice) but I've built quite a few things with this method and veroboard without any issues.

[pedalgrinder]

yeah i've had plenty of success story's to but it only takes one to rip every hair out of your head and your balls you have.

[EATyourGuitar]

working with perf that has no copper is how I started but I really don't think its good for anything. you can learn jedi solder tricks and waste a lot of time. the problem with perf is that rework is almost impossible. when you have 3 components at a junction, they all move when you touch one.

[Renegadrian]

I don't know about autoroute, but on my side I can see how my need to make the best and smallest vero layouts made me understood better a schematic and the way the signal goes thru it...it's a longer process but it got me a little cmore knowledge and confidence about schematics.
my worthless 2 eurocents here!

[DavenPaget]

working with perf that has no copper is how I started but I really don't think its good for anything. you can learn jedi solder tricks and waste a lot of time. the problem with perf is that rework is almost impossible. when you have 3 components at a junction, they all move when you touch one.

You'd better off building another layout ! Like i did ... Jedi moves and solder splashing ... ouch . Or you could also have copper'd perf but it still oxidised QUICK !

[Rick899]

Deadastronaut:    Thanks for posting your example of a layout on DIYLC. That and the info you posted helped me figure out how to use  the program. I downloaded this software and installed it. I installed version 3.0.9 beta. I was able to actually create a layout of a Dualcaster I want to build. But I have encountered a couple of problems.

1. I installed the program and made a shortcut but everytime I click the shortcut, I get a message box that has  run and cancel buttons that asks  if I am sure i want to run this software. Usually you click the shortcut and the program opens without this message. Is that normal for this program or did I do something wrong when installing it?

2. The first layout file I saved and named won't open. I open the program, click  file, then open and I get an error message that says "could not open file check log for details."    Luckily I saved a second copy of the file and that file opens without a problem.  Anyone have an idea why that file won't open? 

3. How do you create an image of the file so that it can be posted on this forum the way Deadastronaut posted his example?  I exported to PDF but photobucket  doesn't recognize either the PDF or the DIYLC document.
Thanks for any  help in figuring out how to solove these problems.

[Rick899]

Here is what I did exported from DITLC as a PNG image.  It is too small.  How can I post it the way Deadastronaut did above so that the posted image will be as large as that one?  thanks.