Your vote for best PCB software?

[ElectricDruid]

A vote from me for DipTrace. I tried Eagle, and I've used Orcad, and I found both of them feel like DOS-era software that's been dragged kicking and screaming into a GUI world. They're fugly and awkward. Diptrace is much more modern feeling, and whilst it isn't perfect, at least it's improving. It does cost money (but nothing like as much as Orcad) and it's also available for Mac, which you can't say of many PCB packages.

Changing software suites, whether for PCBs or word processors, is usually as difficult as getting a divorce, and takes about as long.

I'll have to take your word for that one, RG!!

Tom

[MetalGuy]

eagle eagle eagle.

If you don't have experience with PCB software this is the WORST choice for beginners (and not only).

[R O Tiree]

Hmm - you're saying if you're starting out, to use something simple, but then warn that  " it takes a lot of investment of time (and probably money) to move across to another package"     ...so why not just take the extra few nights to get to grips with a package you won't outgrow?

There's always the question of "Am I going to be any good at this?"  It would be daft to spend money on an all-singing, all-dancing package with a very steep learning curve but be totally unable to actually (a) make it sing or dance and/or (b) lay out a sensible circuit pattern, as RG says.  Given that the object of the exercise is, initially, to learn how to lay out your own circuits, it would seem to make sense to do that on a package that is (a) free and (b) doesn't take very much extra effort to get to grips with, so you can devote all your attention to what you're trying to do.

It might make sense to instantly go to a "grown-up" package if one has used CAD/CAM software of some other type before.  Let's face it, though... your first efforts at layouts are going to be pretty simple circuits to gain experience at this art and also the art of toner transfer or photo-exposure to etch some one-off boards.  ExpressPCB's admittedly "clumsy" net-checking system is more than sufficient for these first steps.

I teach people to fly in the military... you don't stick someone straight into the %^&*pit of a Typhoon - they'd kill themselves in a heartbeat.  Instead, you plonk them into a little prop-driven puddle-jumper for a while, then a more souped-up turbo-prop for a year, then a little single-engine jet and only then do you stick them into their Typhoon fighter.  You don't go straight to tensor calculus when you're learning Mathematics - you start with counting beans.  People who have been involved with electronics for years have the advantage that the industry has made huge strides while they've been watching it, so they've kept pace with the advances as they happened in both hardware and software.  For those just starting out, it's like being thrown into term 1 of an engineering degree when they should be in kindergarten.  This is where this forum scores so highly - the vast majority of "those in the know" never lose sight of this fact and there's none of the elitism that you see on other forums ("I know more than you, so I'm going to make my answer really esoteric, so I can score points offa da n00b").

Long may that continue.

[kodiakklub]

eagle eagle eagle

i never used any PCB software before eagle, but i do come from a CAD background. And i can read a tutorial so eagle ended up the winner. (thank you gauss markov http://gaussmarkov.net/wordpress/tools/software/eagle-cad/). it really isnt too bad once you learn the library (use GM's). took me maybe 4 hours to get the basics. i will admit it the UI is horribly laid out and very inefficient, but im not designing motherboards with it.

[R O Tiree]

Hahahahaha - so much for this forum's obscenity detector... that should read "c o c k pit of a Typhoon" - a perfectly fine word.  Ho hum

[armdnrdy]

Hey Mike,

This is a little off topic but....

I had to look up the "Typhoon" to see what aircraft you were talking about. The only "Typhoon" I was familiar with was made by Hawker. It was a single seat, single prop engine fighter/bomber used in WWII.

This is not the aircraft you were referring to.

When did the British get jet aircraft?   

[slacker]

About 1944

[nomorebetts]

I used Eagle briefly then fell in love with Diptrace as I found it easier to use.
The free version is limited to 300 pins which is more than enough for stompboxes.
And it can import Eagle libraries, schems and layouts.  

[chromesphere]

Another vote for Diptrace.  The 300 pin free version is probably goign to be enough for any beginner, and possible for a long time from then on as well.

If your reading this thread because you are looking into getting into PCB design, check out my 'crash course' in diptrace, specially aimed at designed basic pedal layouts.  I'm a noob at PCB design...and i've managed to get around.  As said, its not perfect.  But i personally found it easier to get into then eagle.

Honestly by the end of the video you should have an idea if its for you or not:

Cheers,
Paul

[moosapotamus]

Nice video, Paul. I've tried working in both DipTrace and Eagle. Between the two, DipTrace is the winner.

I've tried Eagle a number of times and always got fed up with it. When people say, "it's really not that bad," that's not good!

But I think Eagle and DipTrace are both overkill if all you want to do is lay out some stompbox circuits and etch some circuit boards.

I would actually vote for ExpressPCB as the best stompbox layout software... if it exported Gerber files. It's easy to learn and use, gives great results, and so it's probably also the best way to go for beginners. But I confess to getting trapped into using them exclusively for getting boards manufactured. They do excellent work, but you pay extra for the convenience.

Someone mentioned Sprint. I've tried that one, too. And it is bone simple to use. It's like a Kindergarden version of ExpressPCB. No schematic capture, but it exports Gerbers!

~ Charlie

[Steve Mavronis]

ExpressPCB because it's super intuitive and easy to learn to get started laying out your design plus its free and comes with ExpressSCH to draw your schematics too. There is no learning curve to worry about. You can even make new parts and components for your custom library. Print out your layouts and make your own PCB's or optionally use their board making service.

[culturejam]

OP, you might also want to check out KiCAD:
http://www.kicad-pcb.org/display/KICAD/KiCad+EDA+Software+Suite

I've tired several programs, including Diptrace, Eagle, ExpressPCB, KiCAD, and a few others. I kept coming back to Eagle, primarily because there are more tutorials, user forums, add-ons, existing projets, etc. It's got more momentum than any of the others.

Now, that's not to say that Eagle is intuitive. It's not; at least not to me. I liken Eagle to a lot of Microsoft's applications: it's powerful, but by god you are going to things the Eagle way. Whatever you think is logical is irrelevant; you'll do it the Eagle way or it won't work. Took me ages to figure out the fargen parts editor.

But I stay with it now because of the tight integration between schematic and layout, and the error checking and design rules check.

I'd suggest trying Eagle, Diptrace, and KiCad and see which one is least infuriating to use. 

[ElectricDruid]

I'd suggest trying Eagle, Diptrace, and KiCad and see which one is least infuriating to use. 

I suppose a mention should be made of:

http://uk.rs-online.com/web/generalDisplay.html?id=pcb

HTH,
Tom

[J0K3RX]

Sprint 5 or 6

guitarrob - You should have ask a question about religion or politics, would have been less opposing views...

I have all of the programs mentioned here but I always just use Sprint, because I know it and it work for me....

Just bought AutoTRAX Design Express (DEX 2020) about a month ago for $39.00 on sale and haven't touched it yet

Anybody wanna buy it from me?  

[psychedelicfish]

I would say KiCAD, since it is the only one i've ever used, but I found it so infuriatingly bug ridden that it took me hours and hours just to make a pcb layout for a simple mains power supply, so I would recommend that you stay away from KiCAD.

[stevie1556]

I just had a fairly big learning curve to learn ExpressPCB, onto the then find out it doesn't output to Gerber. I'm now learning Eagle, massive learning curve but the autoroute and Gerber outputs makes it worth it.

[Ronan]

If you can do ExpressPCB, then Sprint-Layout is similar, and does gerbers, costs a small amount of money though. There is a free trial version if you want to have a look. Forget about auto-routers, the human brain is the best router

[kodiakklub]

I just had a fairly big learning curve to learn ExpressPCB, onto the then find out it doesn't output to Gerber. I'm now learning Eagle, massive learning curve but the autoroute and Gerber outputs makes it worth it.

dont waste your time with auto trace. you will just end up ripping up half of the traces and redo-ing them. maybe someday ill get around to writing a better tutorial PDF for eagle aimed at the people's republic of pedals.

[pickdropper]

I just had a fairly big learning curve to learn ExpressPCB, onto the then find out it doesn't output to Gerber. I'm now learning Eagle, massive learning curve but the autoroute and Gerber outputs makes it worth it.

dont waste your time with auto trace. you will just end up ripping up half of the traces and redo-ing them. maybe someday ill get around to writing a better tutorial PDF for eagle aimed at the people's republic of pedals.

Yeah, no kidding.  I don't claim to be an expert at PCB design, but I've never had any success with autoroute in any of the programs I've used.  If you place the parts well, it does a better job, but at that point, you can just route it yourself anyway.

[mac]

I tried some of the above but I'm too addicted to Photoshop since '90

mac