Honey Special Fuzz.

[digi2t]

Interesting stuff. Don't know if it's been mentioned elsewhere but the stuff round T10 and T11 are sine wave LFOs, simulator says the T10 one is about 1Hz and the T11 one is 3ish. These then get mixed to give a semi random modulation waveform, you can sort of hear that in Dino's video. A quick and easy mod would be to lift R27 or R29 that would give you two speeds of straight sine wave modulation. The R30 and R31 resistors can be made a bit bigger or smaller to change the speed, you can't vary them much though or it stops oscillating. You'd possibly need a dual pot to keep then the both the same value or it might work just changing one of them.

The inductors appear to make a bandpass filter, basically a Wah.

Excellent work Ian. Gives us a good idea of the lay of the land, and a decent idea of where to tweak for a possible adjustable rate mod. Nicely done.

On another note, my unit doesn't sport the "Honey Co. Ltd." moniker, like the one at the beginning of the thread. I'm wondering if mine isn't an early (1967) unit. Maybe they wanted to test the market first? Or, on the initial run, the name of the company hadn't been established yet? But then again, the "HF-01" on the PCB kind of gives the impression of "Honey Fuzz-01", so maybe the company name was indeed established. Maybe they screwed up the initial batch of badges? Who knows. Here's a close up of mine;



But then, we end up seeing the "HF" on some other fuzz models too. Like the Guyatone FS-3 for example;



Wow. Some real head spinning stuff. Anyway, for more pedal porn, this is a great page; http://d.hatena.ne.jp/Billl/

Also, the original battery cover on mine was AWOL. Pretty well standard fare, after nearly 50 years! A previous owner had made an effort, with a piece of aluminium. Functional, but kind of lacking, in the looks department.



This picture shows a unit, with the original cover;



It then occured to me, having recently dismantled an old Farfisa organ, that I had recouped some nice pieces of cadmium plated sheet metal. The back cover is cadmium plated as well, so maybe I was on to something here? I decided to put that aircraft sheet metal course I took years back to task. After 45 minutes of cutting, bending, grinding, fileing, and drilling, I think I came up with something a little more authentic. Only mechanical difference is that I made the ears longer on mine, to strengthen the door more. The result;







Cover screw courtesy of the Farfisa as well  . Just need to find a piece of white, retro looking, foam now. One rubber (uh, pertified rubber) foot was missing as well, but I did manage to find some identical looking ones on the net. They're in transit.

I love making "Honey" out of dogsh*t (pardon the pun  ). Doesn't always work mind you, but sometimes, you get lucky.

[Mark Hammer]

Um, is it just me or is T12/T13 yet another Fuzz Face variant?

[Gus]

T12 and T13 are not really a FF variant note the feedback from T13 collector to T12 base, that makes a different.  Then look at the Big Cheese schematic

[digi2t]

OK, I'm half way to doing a vero of the Ludwig  .

This must be the most complex vero I've ever done, at 13 trannies (not to mention the two 42TL019 audio transformers!). For some bizarre reason, it was almost one of my fastest. I dunno, so don't ask. Here it is;



It's using the same component numbers as Dirk's schematic, and the wire connection numbers as my wiring drawing.

Needs to be verified....

I'm going to bed now....

[Keppy]

OK, I'm half way to doing a vero of the Ludwig  .

Ludwig? Old projects giving you flashbacks?

[digi2t]

OK, I'm half way to doing a vero of the Ludwig  .

Ludwig? Old projects giving you flashbacks?

It's just that I was thinking that there are 26 (if I remember correctly) transistors in the Ludwig, so I figured that I was half way there.

Actually, doing a vero of the Ludwig would be pretty epic. It's almost tempting. It's the masochist in me screaming to get out  .

[digi2t]

Update,

I found a couple of errors on the layout, and I've updated it. It sometimes take Photobucket some time to update an image, so double check what you're downloading. Also, I managed to reduce the width by a row of holes as well. Here is the same layout, but with the BOM as well;



I've uploaded everything, including schematic and wiring diagram, to the gallery; http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php/v/digi2t/veros/Honey+Special+Fuzz/

Still unverified, but I'm slowly slogging along.

[digi2t]

OK, I had some time, so I did a triple check, and I did spot some errors. They are now corrected, and I would use this to build with. Here is the updated versions, with and without the BOM.





The smallest enclosures I use are the 1590BB style, so this vero is sized to fit widthwise. I figured that way, if another pot, or switch, enters the fray, they'll still be room.

Updated in the gallery as well, also adding some more pics of the real unit, as well as two shots of the trace side for those who wish to confection their own PCB.

[pinkjimiphoton]

holy cow, that's a lot of transistors!!!

having finally gotten a working version of the superfuzz built, i'm ready to tackle this one i think.

gonna check over the BOM and see what i need to order....

hey dino, any chance you might have another dozen or so of the 828's you could sell me?

do ya think any old inductors will work, or do they need to be specific ones bro?

i'd love to take the plunge and verify this...

gotta build another vocalizer too (i got offered enough $$ where my vocalizer is moving out soon)

awesome undertaking.

i knew eventually you'd get to doing a vero of cousin lewdvig, lol...

[digi2t]

holy cow, that's a lot of transistors!!!

having finally gotten a working version of the superfuzz built, i'm ready to tackle this one i think.

gonna check over the BOM and see what i need to order....

hey dino, any chance you might have another dozen or so of the 828's you could sell me?

do ya think any old inductors will work, or do they need to be specific ones bro?

i'd love to take the plunge and verify this...

gotta build another vocalizer too (i got offered enough $$ where my vocalizer is moving out soon)

awesome undertaking.

i knew eventually you'd get to doing a vero of cousin lewdvig, lol...

New SPT video coming soon on the Superfuzz? I really want to hear what those 828's sound like. You know, if I had thought about, I would have matched two of them with my Peak meter for the octave section.

I should be able to send you enough 828's to do this one, plus I'll match up two sets of octave pairs, for this one and the Superfuzz.

As for the inductors, the TDK #41's are pretty much unobtainium. I tested the 42TL019 with my inductance meter, and they come in right around 4 Henry, so I'm thinking that they should do the job. Only trying them will prove right, or wrong. Besides, those little transformers are dirt cheap, about 2 bux each. I've read that they can also be used for Varitone circuits.

As for the Vocalizer, I recommend doing a Talk-a-lizer instead. Performs much better than the Vocalizer, and also plays nicer with other dirt pedals.



Vero of the Ludwig? Hmmmm.... I'm still thinking about it. Gonna get my other projects off my plate, then I'll seriously consider it. I can picture it now.... 247 cuts, 96 jumpers  .

[pinkjimiphoton]

holy cow, that's a lot of transistors!!!

having finally gotten a working version of the superfuzz built, i'm ready to tackle this one i think.

gonna check over the BOM and see what i need to order....

hey dino, any chance you might have another dozen or so of the 828's you could sell me?

do ya think any old inductors will work, or do they need to be specific ones bro?

i'd love to take the plunge and verify this...

gotta build another vocalizer too (i got offered enough $$ where my vocalizer is moving out soon)

awesome undertaking.

i knew eventually you'd get to doing a vero of cousin lewdvig, lol...

New SPT video coming soon on the Superfuzz? I really want to hear what those 828's sound like. You know, if I had thought about, I would have matched two of them with my Peak meter for the octave section.

i didn't even worry about matching them... i DID do an asymetric GE clipper tho with two different style 1n34's... one glass, and two teeny ones in series. it scoops well, but not too much of an octave. give it 20 years to mellow maybe!

I should be able to send you enough 828's to do this one, plus I'll match up two sets of octave pairs, for this one and the Superfuzz.

awesome, thanks bro... i really wanna try and build this...it seems to be a superfuzz with some extra circuitry, what the heck, in for a dollar...

the super sounds great...i ended up doing two slightly different circuits, one from IvIark's layout (i built two, could only get one to work, and had a hell of a time with that one...couldn't get the balance or switch sections working no matter what i tried...i'm talking i dicked with it for 2+ months!!) and the classic from mike livesly, that one worked right out of the gate..and is the one that ended up being bone stock to the original, with the 828's.  it sounds dead on to my shin-ei fuzz wah! amazing...the other one i ended up modding from IvIark's layout a little...added a master volume to it, and the contour sweeps from fuzzy goodness to octave fuzzy goodness...that one has 5088's in it.

when i do a SPT, i think i'm gonna put all three side by side for a shootout. 

but i can't wait to try and build the honey...it sounds really cool! and we're kind of the patron saints of obscurity...lol

As for the inductors, the TDK #41's are pretty much unobtainium. I tested the 42TL019 with my inductance meter, and they come in right around 4 Henry, so I'm thinking that they should do the job. Only trying them will prove right, or wrong. Besides, those little transformers are dirt cheap, about 2 bux each. I've read that they can also be used for Varitone circuits.

ok, i guess i'll have to bite the bullet and order some...i had a couple fasel's kicking around thought they may work. rather not dick around with something like this with 900 transistors!

As for the Vocalizer, I recommend doing a Talk-a-lizer instead. Performs much better than the Vocalizer, and also plays nicer with other dirt pedals.

you read my mind, actually...i didn't care for the vocalizer so much, i thought the talkalyzer sounded better, frankly. thanks for the layout, i've already got it in my archive, but i'll add this to my "to be built " folder.

i just realized last nite...i'm close to 70 builds now, counting all the crap i've given away and sold. and have close to all the fuzzes i ever lusted after!!

fuzzy goodness,,,,, <aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh> 

Vero of the Ludwig? Hmmmm.... I'm still thinking about it. Gonna get my other projects off my plate, then I'll seriously consider it. I can picture it now.... 247 cuts, 96 jumpers  .

to quote john lee hooker, "it's in ya, and it's gonna come out"...

so let that boy boogie!!
peace bro!!   

[digi2t]

Just something I caught: Check out this video on the first version Univox Superfuzz. Pay attention around 2:35.

Check out the "HF" on the back of the board. Just like the "HF" on the back of the Honey Special board. I know Shin Ei took over Honey in '69, so I guess this is remenants of the factory tooling.

A nice little piece of pedal archeology.

[pinkjimiphoton]

that's basically the same board that's in my fuzz wah, too...it's weird.

i wonder if the honey special mutated into or out of the fuzz wah...

seems like the special is the same sound, but with auto sweeping capabilities, maybe that's all it is.

thats some killer work finding that bro.

wait til ya hear the superfuzzes..

[Pacafeliz]

hey folks, sorry for bringing back this zombie thread... hope all's ok!

well i'm throwing the 1st one (the cleaner one) on ebay now, no reserve, and shipping worldwide.
so there you go, just in case you wanna own (and revive) an original one of these...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=190752337219

thanks and good luck!

Pat.

[pinkjimiphoton]

whoo hoo! i got the high bid, but i have a feeling not for long bro.
_
i have a feeling you're gonna do well with this!!

[digi2t]

OK....
SUCCESS!!!!!It works. Here is the verified vero.





Thanks to some typos, I had my oscillation speed on one side going way too fast. I also had a resistor labeled wrong on the fuzz section. All corrected now.

I'll try and get a video out tomorrow, likely the day after though. Fuzz sounds totally raunchy, and with the oscillation on, totally retarded.

I love it! :twisted:

[Govmnt_Lacky]

Holding out for a PCB layout. Already have 3 or 4 I need to do myself 

[pinkjimiphoton]

me wanneeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!

looks great!! damn...only 12,000 more builds to get thru...screw 'em, i'm a gonna go for it i think sooner than later.

[digi2t]

OK, major update....

The 42TL019 transformers just don't cut the mustard. Compared to the TDK 4 Henry inductors, their pretty much spot on for inductance. Problem is resistance. The transformers are more than double the resistance. This makes the "wah" effect very muffled, and DULL. Compared to the original unit, it sounds like an old Maytag chugging away.

So, it was back to the drawing board....

Happy discovery though. Going through my stock, and trying different inductors that I had, I came upon two LT44 transformers that I had bought a while back. Trying the different connections, I found that the outer pins on the secondary really work well. The outer pins of the secondary side, I have 1 Henry, and 60 ohms (versus 4 Henry and 220 ohms of the TDK). It now gives me pretty much the same effect as the original. I'm no expert on inductance, but it's as if the resistance of the transformer plays a bigger role than the inductance. By adjusting the 100nF cap, I could fine tune the tone of the sweep, and I've gone with a 120nF box cap. Not a big change, but my ears said "better".

I also added a Stupidly Wonderful Tone Control. I'm using a B10K pot, with a 18nF cap, and an A50K volume pot. It's subtle, but effective enough. I also replaced the 33nF output cap with a 10uF bi-polar cap. This not only makes the tone variance stand out more, but prevents the DC from hitting the volume pot. Without a cap here, the switch pop is brutal as well.

The veros have been updated to reflect the different transformers. A word of warning though, the LT44's are 5mm bigger than the 42TL019's, but they will JUST sqeeze into the vero. There's an added jumper, since I'm not using the frame as a jumper anymore. As a matter of fact, due to the larger transformer frames, use of the frame tabs is out of the question. I simply folded them under, and used all the connection pins to hold the transformers in place. You might have to shift over a set of holes, so just shift any other components accordingly. The cuts don't change, but pay attention to respect them vis a vis where you're putting the pins.

As for the transistor gains here's what I used in each slot (all 2SC828R's), measured with my Peak Atlas meter; Q1-165, Q2-176, Q3/Q4-182, Q5-163, Q6-172, Q7-178, Q8-181, Q9-176, Q10/Q11-178, Q12-168, Q13-176. Q3/Q4 are matched for the octave section, and Q10/Q11 are matched for... not quite sure, but I figured that if they were doing the same job, why not do it equally. Totally scientific, eh? 

Here's some pics;









and of course, another installment, from the Hen's Tooth Cafe. Side by side shootout.

 

[analogguru]

The principle how this circuit  works is that the inductance of the coil is changed with the DC-current flowing through the coil (as it was done in the Schaller - Rotor Sound too).

So both values are important:
The inductivity for the cut-off frequency and the dc-resistance for the DC-current flowing through the coil - and as a result how much the inductance is changed (and with this the cut-off frequency).

If the DC-resistance of the coil is higher, than less current is flowing through the coil and therefore changing the inductance less.

analogguru