Whammy 4 problem

[monkeyssj1]

Did the true bypass mod by rodrigo constanzo and all went well. Then I tried to do his momentary switch mod not realizing all would go to shit. Took it off put back regular true bypass and I thought everything was fine. However, in this day and age occasionally when the pedal is rocked, it will switch to different pitch settings (as if the rotary knob was turning)... could it be a problem with the optical sensor??? is that thing connected to the rotary settings somehow? I appoligize in advance if I did not do enough research and this is a common problem that I missed.

[pinkjimiphoton]

you need to make sure the momentary switch is normally open, not closed. if you use a closed switch, it will do all kindsa weird stuff.

[monkeyssj1]

okay that's what i felt like was happening! It acted as if the momentary switch was always active unless I stepped on it... I used an X-wing type momentary switch.. Do you have any references for an open one??? or am I misunderstanding how this works?   

[garcho]

How many terminals are on the switch? I use momentary switches like these. Connect to the middle terminal and then use either the right or left terminal for NO or NC.

[pinkjimiphoton]

easiest way is drill a little hole in the top of the box somewhere, and mount the original switch in there. it's a momentary, normally open switch.

connect it to the two centerposts of the true bypass footswitch you installed. (if a dpdt). now, if you wanna engage the effect, step on the footswitch.

if you wanna or need to calibrate the pedal, use the original push switch.  no need to buy another switch.

if ya DO need another switch, go hit radio shack or something.

you need a spst momentary normally open push switch. done deal.

what you're doing is using the momentary to bridge between effect on or off. this is a digital pedal, so it's listening for binary information...yes/no in this case. the original
footswitch could be used to either engage the effect or bypass it electronically. it could also be used to "calibrate" the pedal.

if you used a momentary normally close switch, the effect would always be engaged...so the pedal probably couldn't be switched right, as it's looking for a momentary short to trigger the switching circuit. that's possibly what happened to you. i dicked around for a week or two figuring out my whammy. you can change the presets with a pedal, too. worth trying...just don't drill the box unless you like it.

so...anyways.. if ya true bypass it, you're switching the input from effect to bypassed to out. you want the effect to always be ON in this case, so when ya stomp the switch it activates the effect.

but...if ya have the normally closed switch, it's effectively a short circuit across the bypass switch...so every time you hit the switch, one time it will be effected,the next push may be thru the effect, but with the EFFECT in bypass, the time after that you'll have the effect on, but the true bypass engaged, and finally, you'll have the effect engaged with both the input to the effect and the output from the effect both on.

pain in the tookus.

was that's what was kinda happening? cuz it sounds like what i went thru with something similar on mine.

[pinkjimiphoton]

How many terminals are on the switch? I use momentary switches like these. Connect to the middle terminal and then use either the right or left terminal for NO or NC.

those ones are no good, cuz ya just wanna complete the circuit...that cycles left-right left right, it's a spdt.

all you need is a spst switch...off/on, only two poles. the switch you're showing chooses between two things this thing is on, or this thing is on...you just need one choice, on or off.
it'll still work, but it may need to be played with some, or you may need to double click it.

for the actual true bypass, you need a standard blue 3pdt like we all use these days.




but for the momentary, it's gotta be yes/no on/off  open/closed...a simple single pole single throw switch. anything else won't work right.

http://www.smallbearelec.com/servlet/Detail?no=672



you don't need a particularly heavy duty switch if all you use it for is calibration.

however, with this switch also, if you mount it near the original bypass switch where you can catch it with your foot, you can bypass the effect or not with the 3pdt, and then use the momentary to turn the whammy off and on for quick stabs if you want to...every time you step on it, you'll get off and on.

can be cool, i'm thinking about doing it to mine. fwiw, i opted to not do the true bypass. instead i wired it upf for remote footswitch preset switching.

but due to noise issues, i probably am gonna tb it. when i do, i'll use a momentary mounted near the bypass switch...maybe even use a dpst so i can have an led light with it so i don't get too confused.

[garcho]

All you have to do is leave one terminal open and its a SPST switch. The point is that it can be a SPST NO, or SPST NC, depending on what you need.

[pinkjimiphoton]

kinda. is it labeled as to which terminal is which? i bought some of them and they did NOT work as expected...instead of just making the connection or breaking it, it's switching between sides on each push ... push it, and it connects and closes the circuit while the switch is down, turning the effect off and on. but...on a spdt switch (three terminals) it's gonna connect first one side, then the other..that's where the problem can come from with some of them, cuz the first push it connects the circuit momentarily, then switches to the other side where there's no connection. i guess as long as it's momentary normally open, you're good. if it's not n.o. or a "Click" switch, it'll mess ya up!!  i bought a bunch of different switches when i was wiring mine up, the best seemed to be the simplest.

for the remote pedal, one of the ones you posted is perfect, along with a dpst in parallel. then you can go up or down in increments  with the presets with almost inaudible latency.


the point is tho, it's cheaper to just use the spst. harder to mess it up, too. and the good thing is if you're not gonna stomp on it, you can use a mini or submini push switch.

[monkeyssj1]

yea that sounds about right. when I get home im going to open it up and take a look. I currently have a micro switch in the front of the pedal also like rodrigo has on his site. So would that in any way effect what i'm trying to do? If i have the output of the effect going to the 3pdt and then to the momentary which then goes to the input... that would be fine right? I've never wired two switches back to back in succession before

[pinkjimiphoton]

NO, that won't work.

you got the true bypass wired as on rodrigo's site, right? that will not turn the effect off or on, it will only determine whether the guitar signal goes straight thru from input to output, or goes thru the effect circuitry. you need to have the circuit off/ on on the momentary switch, exactly as wired originally. you just want to move it.

the idea is to keep the effect on, all the time...the bypass circuit just bypasses it. what you need the momentary switch for is to calibrate the pedal, and to initially make sure the whammy is "on". that's why it's advised to move it to the front of the pedal case (or somewhere else convenient).

if you want a momentary footswitch to stab the effect off and on with, just wire it in parallel.

ya know, i need to revisit that link so i'm not confusing this myself...could you post it please so i can see just what you're trying to accomplish?

[monkeyssj1]

here ya go boss 

http://www.rodrigoconstanzo.com/whammy-mod/

at the moment my black and white wires are connected to a micro on off switch like he has at the top of the pedal.


You wouldn't happen to know why my pedal also switches modes occasionally when rocked would you?

[pinkjimiphoton]

ok, the black and white wires, again, are what actually turn the effect off and on. these need to go to a SINGLE POLE, SINGLE THROW momentary NORMALLY OPEN switch, like the one that is the stock switch. this is used to calibrate the whammy, and to ensure it's on or off. this is SEPARATE from the other switches in rodrigo's page.

with me still?


the OTHER switches are for true bypassing whether the "turned on" circuit is in line with the guitar signal or not.

one is pretty standard true bypass....let's look at it.



in this case, the outside set of three lugs is what switches the effect (always on) between on and bypassed. the jumper at the top is the bypass when the pedal is off.
the guitar signal from the input jack enters the middle left terminal, and exits the middle right terminal to the output jack. (the middle terminals, don't worry about yet, they're for the led)
the bottom left sends the guitar signal to the input of the board,
the bottom right returns the signal from the output of the board.

the other switch in parallel is an example of the kind of switch i warned about not needing. in THIS case, what it does is MOMENTARILY engage the effect as long as the switch is depressed.

the signal enters the middle, and exits the middle...exactly the same as the regular bypass switch, so just wire all the pins in parallel. now when you step on the switch, the whammy will be on as long as your foot is held down (cuz you're bypassing the bypass switch with a momentary switch) and as soon as you lift your foot, it will be in bypass again.

see, the original switch and the bypass are doing two completely different things.

now...that said..take your led b+ from where rodrigo suggests, limit it with a 3.9k-ish resistor so ya don't blow the led,  and connect that to the bottom center terminal of the blue plastic 3pdt switch. connect the center pin of the middle three, and connect it to ground somewhere. now when you engage the switch to turn the effect on, the led will light up, and go off when you step on it again.

the effect is always on...it just when it's bypassed, the audio doesn't go thru it.

i would leave the original led in place, so when the effect is on, you know it (rather than guessing) and add a secondary led somewhere for the bypass circuit. that way, you can be sure the effect is on, and whether in or out of bypass with a glance.

as for it changing programs when you move the treadle? might be lead dress interfering. check your wiring.

if you decide you want to add remote footswitching for the presets, let me know...it's pretty easy to do, i put a thread up here somewhere, tho i don't know if i updated it...

i did update it, but didn't add another diagram. basically, all ya need is 2 stereo 1/4 inch jacks that isolates ground, a little microphone cable (two conductor plus shield) and a pair of momentary normally open switches...a spst, and a dpst in parallel.

there's a link to a website about it on this thread, along with my diagram:

http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=96337.0

[monkeyssj1]

ok thanks for the input. i'll probably try out later tonight. after some inspection of the pedal... i realize it switches settings when pressure is applied to the treadle particularly in the down settings.... =/ i checked the wiring i did for the true bypass and everything looks good and clean

[pinkjimiphoton]

that's because you need to re-calibrate the pedal, bro.

that part's easy!

In the unlikely event that the Whammy's expression pedal does not respond properly (such
as the note does not bend up or return back to the correct pitch), the Whammy's expression
pedal may need to be recalibrated. This calibration procedure is best performed once the
unit has reached full operating temperature after at least 15 minutes of use.

http://www.digitech.com/system/documents/27/original/Whammy%20Calibration%20Guide.pdf?1287001944

1. Disconnect the power from the Whammy™
pedal.

2. Rock the expression pedal forward to the
toe down position.

3. Press and hold the effect on/off footswitch while
reconnecting the power. (the original single pole/single throw switch or whatever you replaced it with)

4. Release the footswitch as soon as you see
one of the preset LEDs begin flashing, which
indicates that you are in pedal calibration mode. After
the footswitch is released, the LED will continue flashing.
Note: If the footswitch is held too long, the LED will
stop flashing and stay lit. If this happens, repeat the
procedure starting back at Step 1.

5. Rock the expression pedal fully back (toe up) and
then forward (toe down) two or more times.


6. Press the effect on/off footswitch again to exit
the setup mode.

This completes the expression pedal calibration
procedure.

try it, post back. hopefully that'll be the end of your issues, bro

[monkeyssj1]

unfortunately it only did what it was supposed to. so now the pedals calibrated which is good, but it still changes modes when rocked occasionally

[pinkjimiphoton]

hmmmm.. check the lead dress inside, make sure nothing's getting hit by the moving parts..other than that, no idea unfortunately!!

did you use shielded cable for the bypass? maybe you're picking up program change by inductance, or something...all bets off with digital stuff!!
weird things happen.

[monkeyssj1]

i know digital stuff scares me. Thank you for all your help though jimi. I'll get this figured out eventually.

[pinkjimiphoton]

it's probably something stupid bro...usually seems to be what always goes wrong!! lol

i got faith in ya bro, you'll figure it out. wish i could be more help.

worst case scenario, send it to digitech, they have like a flat 40 dollar (or something like that) bench fee to fix their products.

at least then ya could re-do it if you have to!!

fwiw, that's why i didn't do the TB on it...read of too many people having issues with noise.